There has been much discussion in recent weeks about the return of an AFL reserves competition after the AFL had a meeting with club presidents and CEOs.
In theory, it sounds like a great idea, but there is no real relevance or gain from reintroducing a reserves competition.
Even if the AFL does decide to bring back a reserves competition, it wouldn’t be in the near future. It would be an expensive undertaking and would most likely have to wait until a new broadcast deal came through to help fund it.
The league’s resources are already being stretched with the AFLW competition, which will expand further in both 2019 and 2020.
1999 was the last season where there was a dedicated reserves league. AFL-listed players who now aren’t picked for the seniors play in state leagues which include the VFL (Victoria), SANFL (South Australia), WAFL (Western Australia) and NEAFL (New South Wales, Queensland, Northern Territory and ACT).
(Photo by Michael Dodge/AFL Media/Getty Images)
12 of the 18 AFL clubs currently have their own stand-alone reserves side, the other six are linked with other state clubs in their respective leagues. Fremantle/Peel Thunder, West Coast/East Perth, Carlton/Northern Blues, Melbourne/Casey Demons, Hawthorn/Box Hill and St.Kilda/Sandringham.
The coaches from the two Queensland clubs, Chris Fagan from Brisbane and Stuart Dew from the Gold Coast, have come out and endorsed the idea of bringing back an AFL reserves competition. Fagan believed this would be an advantage for both players and coaches, referring to the fact that he got his first chance at AFL coaching with the Melbourne reserves.
He said it would help team spirit by having both teams play at the same ground, and would help make the weekly training schedule for both sides easier to manage. Dew followed on this point, saying, “It would actually bring the club closer if you travelled together”.
“At the moment they are connected all week and then they split,” he said. Having the club all together would be a positive.
That is probably one of the only positives you could have from reintroducing the AFL reserves league. If clubs stay together, the logistics of travelling to two locations might become less of a problem and makes flying emergencies less of an issue.
The idea of curtain raisers doesn’t add much value, as these days most fans don’t show up until maybe an hour before the game.
It’s what we will lose if they introduce the AFL reserves league which is the most important.
These state leagues, the VFL, WAFL, SANFL and NEAFL will become obsolete. This will be a detriment to the game in the long run, because these state leagues have been breeding grounds for many AFL players over the years.
Yes, the leagues will still continue, but they won’t have the same pull and attraction if the chance to play and test yourself against AFL-listed players is taken away.
The VFL is thought of the best league outside of the AFL and has been producing AFL players for decades. A good example for this is the Fothergill-Round medal which is awarded to the most promising young player in the VFL competition.
Out of the past ten winners of the award, seven are currently on AFL lists, including names like Michael Barlow, Michael Hibberd, Dean Towers, Kane Lambert and most recently Bayley Fritsch.
(AAP Image/Julian Smith)
The WAFL is one of the other strong leagues and without it, we wouldn’t have had some of the stars we have today. Both Matt Priddis and Hayden Ballantyne won WAFL best and fairest (Sandover Medal) before being drafted into the AFL.
Tim Kelly was runner-up in the Sandover medal in 2017 and has already shown great talent in his three games for Geelong this season, demonstrating what clubs could miss out on if they overlook these state leagues.
In the most recent AFL Draft, 15 players were picked up by AFL clubs as mature-age players with another three being drafted after spending at least a season or two out the AFL. From these 18 players drafted, ten have already played a game this season with seven making their AFL debuts.
This shows how important these state leagues are for finding talent that may have been missed in previous seasons.
These state leagues are important and taking AFL clubs out of them and making a stand-alone AFL reserves league will only disadvantage these leagues. Yes, in theory, having an AFL reserves competition sounds smart, but there is no relevance and you’re losing more than you’re gaining in the long run.
The AFL should use its funds expanding and growing the game, not on a reserves competition that offers little to no benefits.
Zaco_
Roar Rookie
I support the Idea of bringing back the AFL Reserves. Just have the same fixture as the AFL but change the kickoff 2 hours before the Seniors and open gates when it’s half time in the reserves competition so Supporters can have something to watch before the game, for example: 4:45 PM-Adelaide Oval (Actual Game 7:20 PM) Adelaide Crows R vs Port Adelaide Power R Reserves Teams will train with the Seniors Squad and have a Self Reserves training once a week. When the the Finals, If the Seniors team are in the Finals and the Reserves too they will play on the same day at the same venue. For Example 1st-Adelaide Crows R (Seniors-10th) 2nd-Melbourne Demons (Seniors-6th) 3rd-Fremantle Dockers R (Seniors-11th) 4th-Western Bulldogs R (Seniors-1st) 5th-Sydney Swans R (Seniors-2nd) 6th-Hawthorn Hawks R (Seniors-17th) 7th-St Kilda Saints R (Seniors-9th) 8th-Essendon Bombers R (Seniors-16th) Thursday 5:30 PM-Marvel Stadium (Seniors: Bulldogs v Tigers) Adelaide Crows R vs Western Bulldogs R Friday 5:25 PM-Sydney Cricket Ground (Seniors: Swans v Port) Sydney Swans R vs Essendon Bombers R Saturday 1:10 PM-Princes Park (Seniors: Saints and Hawks didn’t make finals so the reserves play at a different venue) Hawthorn Hawks R vs St Kilda Saints R Saturday 6:05 PM-Melbourne Cricket Ground (Seniors: Demons vs Cats) Melbourne Demons R vs Fremantle Dockers R
Wayne
Guest
Gee - A carlton reserves team - they must be good
Timmuh
Roar Guru
Its wrse than that though. The administrative bodies in Victoria, Tasmania and NT are AFLV, AFLT, AFLNT - yet the one part of footy they have absolutely zero say over is the AFL. It shows where their focus is (the name is a symptom, not a cause) and that focus has destroyed the integrity of the VFA/VFL; and obliteraed the sport throughout Tasmania. From bush league to state league AFL Tasmania and the AFL have played direct (seemingly deliberate at times) hands in the death of clubs.
Joffa the Boofhead
Guest
Like pulling out the Sydney trams, goodness knows why the league ever decided to toss the reserves? Just to keep the old VFA clubs relevant? Bringing back the reserves is the first thing I would do as league boss. We need curtain raisers and good competition for our next 18s. Currently the NEAFL is about the same standard as the Geelong or Ballarat leagues. It is a joke.
Liam Salter
Roar Guru
I know you're being incredibly sarcastic, I think, but kids or masters wouldn't be the worst idea... I mean, Auskicker's at half time works pretty well.
I ate pies
Guest
But no-one will turn out to watch them. Kids make up a significant portion of the population too - let's have an under 10's game as a curtain raiser. Or maybe a masters game? There's lots of old people around.
Aligee
Guest
Cains and Newcastle may provide teams at some stage, but IMO it wont work or have the support after an initial period, Ainslie FC is one of the most wealthy football in Australia and they dropped out due to the costs but also and maybe even a bigger reason was the lack of support the team received, when they are not playing their traditional rivals like they have for the last 80-90 years it is hard to build passion, Cairns and Newcastle comps are based on local rivalries, not only that but all the best players would be playing out of town every second week, i predict a Burnie Dockers type scenario, where at the end of the day most players want to play with their mates and locally without travel. This may be out of left field but how does a mid week night AFL'9 comp played that would include a Cairns and Newcastle, McKay, the Gong, Darwin teams etc Foxtel sponsored go. In fact lets go even crazier and have a AFL 9's Australia wide mid week cup that any and every club could enter, ending up with probably of course AFL teams playing off midweek a few weeks before finals start.
Alicesprings
Guest
Interesting reflections on the NEAFL. Obviously it’s not as strong as the southern leagues but the gap is no where near as wide as many suggest. The standard has improved dramatically since its inception and no doubt will continue to evolve with or without AFL club involvement. Will be interesting to see if/when teams are admitted from Cairns and Newcastle.
Slane
Guest
This is exactly why I can't understand people being against it. It will get rid of the strange situation where we basically have AFL reserves teams playing a handful of random survivors. Let the AFL clubs have their own seperate reserves comp and then the Port Melbournes, Frankstons and Werribees of the world can play against their peers.
User
Roar Rookie
As a long suffering Perth fan I agree.
Aligee
Guest
It seems to me that VFL (A) teams like Williamstown, Port Melbourne, Sandringham etc who have fantastic 150 year histories etc may actually be better of going to the VAFA instead of playing AFL club reserve teams. The VFL destroyed the VFA which BTW was a promotion and relegation comp, the fans of the above clubs may actually enjoy the VAFA better, which at the top level is a very good standard.
Timmuh
Roar Guru
I'm not so sure, in the medium term. In the short term it would be very hard. Especially in Victoria, clubs have had their identity ripped apart by the dominance of an AFL overlord. After all this time it will be very difficult. That has been seen when clubs have lost their and they will need support (what happens in NSW and Qld is another question) as their lost identity has meant relying on another club's supporter base. Box Hill might do OK, they are subservient to Hawthorn but not to the extent of seen at some such as the former Preston. As things are the state leagues have no integrity as competitions. Some clubs are playing to win, some are playing to develop players, some don't know what they're doing because they are sort of a club and sort of not. Again, this is worse in Victoria where few standalone clubs truly exist. In the WAFL and SANFL, especially the AFL clubs basically field their own sides, the remaining clubs can be true to themselves and aim for premierships. The NEAFL would probably end up being split, not such a bad thing if a true state competition was brought in to Queensland - with Cairns represented for example. That takes financial support again, but the good of the game is more than just the AFL and its not as though the NEAFL doesn't get assistance now.
Cat
Roar Guru
He also admitted it’s too small a sample set to know if it’s a trend or whether it’s just this year.
aparth
Guest
A Reserves competition would work if we stop assuming that second-tier leagues would fold. It may instead reinvigorate the grassroots/community nature of these competitions, especially if some talented marketers get involved. We need to ask first, what do the players and coaches want? Based on Gary Ayres' recent comments it appears making the clearer distinction between professional and semi-pro would better define the game. AFL Reserves would be made up of: - Those on AFL lists - Part-time rookies (in terms of pay, but signed up on AFL lists) - An adjustable quota (depending on injuries) of mature aged VFL standard players (Hannan from WB a few years ago) still keen on giving AFL a crack - Recently delisted players kept around the club for coaching/leadership reasons (Hodge would not have to have gone to Brisbane) Given the number of youth coming out of the TAC Cup and not being drafted, becoming a part-time rookie would be a good avenue for them and the clubs. This competition is also where the mid-season trading idea could be trialled (initially with those NOT on AFL lists - especially trading of the part-time rookies would be an interesting development). Curtain raisers would get the crowds into the grounds earlier (leading to more purchases for the AFL) and build team unity. Also given that pre-game warm ups have this year been done away with, there won't be the issue of forcing the games to finish too early. This competition could also function like the pre-season, with slightly shorter quarters and rules like the 9 point super goals. The VFL/WAFL/SANFL would: - Be freed of the inconsistency that comes with valuable players being called up for AFL duties - Be more coachable as the club will train together - Include more players from the amateur league who would be keen to develop their careers to a semi-pro level - Potentially not lose out on former AFL players who are currently giving preference to suburban footy. Removing AFL affiliation makes it a more comfortable environment to return to, with less heavy emphasis on pre-seasons etc. - Return to a truly local competition. As another commenter mentioned, why bother going to watch your team get flogged by a mostly AFL derived team? These clubs can now work on building team identities, welcome community events and work on youth teams. - Teams from the current VAFA may be promoted to fill any voids, and it could work on a relegation system like the EPL. The only reason the teams would die off is if the players and coaches lost interest and the club had no interest in encouraging families to get involved. Football is an exciting and watchable sport at any level when teams are evenly matched. Make it welcoming and people will come.
Birdman
Guest
cos they make up just over half of the population.....
Pope Paul VII
Guest
Absolutely. And The Bluebirds. Only good thing about Carlton.
Pope Paul VII
Guest
You young whippersnapper. In Sydney in the mid 80s, new friends and colleagues used to say to me( somewhat incredulously as they were stunned anyone actually played this mysterious code) "you play VFL!?" when they learned I played aussie rules. I never corrected them!
Tom Simon
Roar Pro
In all seriousness, I think that the reserves league is a good idea in theory (especially for clubs in non-Melbourne clubs), but wouldn't work in practice. Some sort of pre-match though would be a good way of getting fans through the gates, especially at games that don't generally draw big crowds..
Tom Simon
Roar Pro
If we brought in a reserves league, why not have a crack at promotion - relegation!
Slane
Guest
According to Gary Ayres, his club is struggling to attract any top-end talent because the VFL is too much like the AFL reserves comp. Ex-AFL players aren't interested in playing in the VFL because the standards/club commitments are too close to AFL already.