Folau is ignorant of his responsibility in society

"We need a more humane dialogue on such weighty matters and , possibly, social media is an inadequate.." Couldn't agree more. Was this issue handled correctly by Rugby Australia from the very beginning? The reliance on punitive contractual remedies to force someone not to act in line with their religious believes is naïve. The likely termination of Folau's international career is an lose-lose outcome that could have been avoided. Humane dialogue would have a greater chance to change Folau's believes and his behaviour than blunt contractual instruments. Social media with its simplistic requirements are just inadequate and cannot replace debate. Even the media sensationalise the issue without providing a proper context or promote different views on the topic. Did we make any progress or did we learn anything from this sorry episode?

Fox, I wonder whether your response on free speech is a little too simplistic? I stated earlier that I also wonder what the public media response on ‘free speach’ from the Murdoch press might have been if the high profile author of such a meme had been Muslim advocating a fundamentalist view of ‘jihad’ against the infidels? I suspect quite different. Speech like action has social consequences especially across the vast genie of social media networks we now endure as ‘free speech’ at the expense of more humane dialogue. IF has a right to speak, but the ‘banality of evil’ comes to mind that references the ignorance of the defences we often use as humans to project and support ‘our’ point of view or beliefs.The insight and source of this phrase comes from the 1960s trial of the Nazi Adolf Eichmann who defended his actions during the Jewish Holocaust as ‘doing his job’. What Hannah Arendt, who coined the phrase , indicated was that in truly believing in his innocence and using the line of argument ‘of doing his job as a Nazi’ as his defence ... his crime was ultimately that he had failed to think deeply into the context of his words and subsequent actions when condemning his fellow human beings to a ‘hellish’ death on earth... & thus abdicating his humanity. Although this is an extreme example , I think the insight it offers may be apt. This is the ‘banality of evil’ - what happens when we fail to think before we act through our words & actions. IF’s ‘thoughtlessness’ in posting such a expedient meme is the ultimate source of his ignorance... irrespective of his beliefs and intentions.. because it indicates and absence of judgement which ironically ( for all his Christian Faith) is possibly a ‘moral lapse’ on his behalf. We need a more humane dialogue on such weighty matters and , possibly, social media is an inadequate in the decontextualised form that IF’s meme was delivered, because it panders to desire , not deep listening ... &thinking.K

"Freedom of speech does not mean individuals are able to say and do as they please." It actually means exactly that as you do not deliberately incite violence - exactly that. Once you start to shackle the freedoms of speech, it is enslaved.

Australian Sport has a history of racism and exclusiveness. Please check your facts. in 2019 we are equally bigoted toward Christians in Sport and Pacific Islanders. This exclusion and hate speech should end. In the 1920s Doug Nicholls was persuaded by a Carlton football talent scout to try out for Carlton. He was successful, however, was only allowed to train with the team not play. The other players didn’t want an Indigenous person to play on their team and “it was claimed his ‘smell’ was intolerable to players and trainers alike." Phil Krakouer describes how he regularly shook opposing player’s hands before a game as a sign of sportsmanship. He recalls one instance where after putting out his hand and saying “Good luck, mate”, the opposing player refused his hand claiming that he did not shake hands with Indigenous people because they smelt. Chris Lewis, Troy Ugle, Michael Long and Derek Kickett, Indigenous AFL players, received hate mail which included death threats In 1993 Nicky Winmar and Gilbert McAdam, both Indigenous players for St Kilda were reserves entering the field at half time. Upon entering the field through the tunnel they were racially abused by Collingwood fans Until the 1960s race was not considered in rugby league because it was “a white man’s game”. “Institutionalised racism meant that few Aboriginal men played rugby league at the highest level”. The only exceptions were “outstanding” players . Eddie Gilbert was a cricket player. While a talented bowler, “bowl[ing] Bradman for a duck”, he was criticised for his bowling technique in a similar way to other Indigenous cricketers before him. Some argue that this was a product of racial discrimination. After leaving cricket he became mentally ill part of which resulted from the racial discrimination he experienced.

Wow. Let's get rid of the church hey. Way off the mark and very typical of those preaching the Izzy is a villain, I'm all about inclusiveness. Your inclusiveness is, 'you're with me, or you're wrong'.

My post questioning why Alan Jones sexuality it relevant is deleted, but innuendo around it is fine apparently. Interesting.

Sebastian, I’ve done you the privilege of reading your article and I don’t agree with what you are saying. Good luck, good bye.

Try this one: https://www.ag.gov.au/RightsAndProtections/HumanRights/Human-rights-scrutiny/PublicSectorGuidanceSheets/Pages/Righttofreedomofopinionandexpression.aspx

"Not My Circus, Not my Monkeys".... anymore.

I cannot stand Alan Jones. His exercise of power is very damaging. However, as with anyone else, his sexuality is private and really should not be used as a debating point.

It was by missionaries. Are you saying this brand of extreme Christianity - Israel frequently posts sermons from nutty American televangelists - was founded in the pacific islands?

Sheikh’s comment is spot-on. If you read Gal 5:19-21 with the New Testament vice lists in 1 Cor 6:9 and 1 Tim 1:10, Folau may conclude that homosexuals was just omitted from the list of those that will not inherent the Kingdom of God. E.g. ESV translation of 1 Cor 6:9 states: “….Do not be deceived: neither the sexually immoral, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor men who practice homosexuality nor thieves, nor the greedy, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor swindlers will inherit the kingdom of God.” (ESV). It is important to note that the context of 1 Cor 6 is about lawsuits among believers and 1 Tim 1 is about false teachers. There are two problems with this list: 1) The list is not comprehensive. The Bible clearly states that no-one will inherent the Kingdom of God unless they repent. E.g. Rom 3:23-24: “for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God, and all are justified freely by his grace through the redemption that came by Christ Jesus”. 2) Why specifically include homosexuals and not others? To understand why this is a problem we need to understand how the New Testament vice lists were interpreted and translated across time and place and how that shaped the our perceptions of homosexuality today. There are two words that are key in these passages: “Arsenokoitēs” and “Malakoi" – The translation of the former is especially ambiguous and clearly a product of time, place and the struggles against the limitations of any given language. Just compare the modern European language translations and there is a lack of consensus if "arsenokoites" covers homosexuality in general or not and compare it with the ESV: • English (Douay-Rheims Catholic Bible, Challoner Revision, 1749): "them who defile themselves with mankind" • Danish: "Syndere imod Naturen" (sins against nature) • French (Ostervald, 1744): "les abominables" (the abominables) • French (Louis Segon, 1910): "les infâmes" (the infamous) • Irish (William O'Domhnuill, 1602): "dáoine míonadúrtha" (unnatural people) • Spanish (Reina Valera, 1909): "los sodomitas" (sodomites, a term that in itself is open to wide interpretation) • Swedish (1917): "för dem som... onaturlig vällustsynd" (those who sin unnaturally) Arsenokoitēs (αρσενοκοίτης) is often translated as a portmanteau (combination) of arsen, one of the Greek words for man, and koite, the Greek word for bed, echoing Leviticus 18:22 and therefore translated directly as “manbedders”. Arsenokoites is extremely rare in ancient Greek - so rare, there it is only used twice in these two vice lists in the New Testament and that there is no other extant use predating or contemporary to the Bible. The context in which it is used in Corinthians suggests that it is the dominant partner that is the sinner and that it could be extended to include heterosexual sodomists as well. Modern Ancient Greek scholars that studied non-Biblical text concluded that the word when used in Ancient Greek writings refer to those that sexually exploit others and not homosexuals. They use the English word “understand” to explain that the words “under” and “stand” can be used in a way to describe a new concept that is not related to the meaning of the separate parts. With more liberal Christians they insist that Arsenokoites include those that are pimps, pedophiles and those guilty of sexual slavery. There is no more evidence to support this meaning than any other. What we need to realize is that the interpretation and translation of 1 Cor 6:9 and 1 Tim 1:10 are problematic and that we therefore need to take extreme care if we want to use these texts to condemn other to hell. Especially if we apply these texts to condemn those that this text clearly does not apply to e.g. lesbians that are in long term loving relationships. At least we should question if our willingness to condemn others are a product of poor biblical scholarship and/or a product of our culture, time and place.

It's undertaken by ASADA for Australia https://www.asada.gov.au/anti-doping-programmes/whereabouts An athlete in the RTP must specify one hour every day, between 5 am and 11 pm, when they will be available for testing. The athlete must tell us where they will be for this hour and make sure that they are at the specified place. They must also specify their regular schedule, including: * address and contact details * if they have a disability that may affect testing * location details for where they will be staying for each day in the quarter * location details for where they will be training, working or doing any other regular * activity for each day in the quarter * the usual times that these activities would take place * location details for any events they are competing in.

You have to separate freedom of speech from hate speech, of course.

Freedom of expression is more important than being politically correct.If you can’t see through the various narratives of the daily news ,then you’re the problem. Sacrificing public figures just because they don’t project the right public image or don’t fit into the narrative of the day,is the problem. All those who disgracefully don’t support Izzie -YOU are the problem.

How does WADA work re: contactability? Looked at their online guideline and didn’t find it

In this manner Tonga obtained its Christian monarchy and became subservient to the British, who proceeded to control its foreign policy. Tonga did not become fully independent until 1970. Tonga was not settled by Europeans, but it was colonized by European ideology as surely as the rest of the region.

A simple Wikipedia search would suggest you are wrong DaveR. “Australia does not have explicit freedom of speech in any constitutional or statutory declaration of rights, with the exception of political speech which is protected from criminal prosecution at common law per Australian Capital Television Pty Ltd v Commonwealth. There is however an implied freedom of speech that was recognised in Lange v Australian Broadcasting Corporation. In 1992 the High Court of Australia judged in the case of Australian Capital Television Pty Ltd v Commonwealth that the Australian Constitution, by providing for a system of representative and responsible government, implied the protection of political communication as an essential element of that system. This freedom of political communication is not a broad freedom of speech as in other countries, but rather a freedom whose purpose is only to protect political free speech. This freedom of political free speech is a shield against government prosecution, not a shield against private prosecution (civil law). It is also less a causal mechanism in itself, rather than simply a boundary which can be adjudged to be breached. Despite the court's ruling, however, not all political speech appears to be protected in Australia and several laws criminalise forms of speech that would be protected in republic countries such as the United States.” I would also suggest a read of the Lange v Australian Broadcasting Corporation findings. The “implied freedom of speech” in Australia is in fact very limited.

In fact, the missionaries were in the region because of the colonization process. They introduced Christianity to Tonga and almost immediately it resulted in civil war. The Christians won, the old religion and its long-held customs were crushed.

And blackbirding was a delightful jaunt loved by all.