Israel, Gazza and the controversy

I’m glad to see that some people are thinking. Well said.

You’re hiding behind “the law” and you’re proselytising your worldview under the guise of simply following the law. If “the law” called for the hanging of a minority group based on eg race, religion, sexual preference etc would you uphold and defend the law as you are doing in this instance? I suspect, and sincerely hope that you wouldn’t! Your position and reasoning falls apart at this point! Your position is therefore subjective, not objective (an objective position would be an absolute position of always upholding the law no matter what the law stated). Stardust did not place morals into our hearts, God did. You’re currently upholding gay rights but what is that based on? It can’t be the law because I suspect that you wouldn’t defend a law that said certain minority groups should be hanged. I would therefore argue that your position is solely subjective ie it is based on your opinion and worldview. You cannot have it both ways if you’re being consistent. Furthermore, you cannot argue for objective morality eg human rights as an atheist (I’m not sure that you are one, just making the point for those that are) because there is no objective truth - what objective authority says that you should have any rights at all, or anyone else for that matter? How can murder wrong if there is no objective morality? Furthermore, if there is no intelligent designer or creator then no-one designed your brain for the purpose of thinking. When chemical reactions happen inside your brain they give you a sensation called thought. How can you trust your thinking to be true seeing that it is an unguided process of chemical reactions? You choose to live your life by a book ie books of man-made laws and legal precedents. I choose to live mine first and foremost by Gods book, as I suspect Izzy does - we just chose different books as our primary guide but we both try to live our lives by books. Christians are commanded to obey the laws of government with one caveat - so long as it doesn’t break Gods law. So if an evil government legalised the murder of X people I would disobey. I’m prepared to be marginalised, persecuted, tortured and killed for my beliefs, many believers before me already have and that’s just the way that it will be for some of us in the future. Your position up to this point (if you are to remain consistent) is that you would support murder because it is “the law.” If you would not support legalised murder then you need to come clean and say that you’re upholding gay rights at the expense of freedom of speech because it is your subjective opinion and that you’re proselytising your opinion! Think about it carefully, you can’t use the law as an excuse.

Let he who is without sin cast the first stone.

Again...no no You are accusing me of proselytising, when all I'm in fact doing is reminding you (and others) that gay people are equal under the law. It is the law, not the Bible, that runs this country. I've never said Folau broke the law. But he absolutely is peddling a belief that a book should be the primary text on which all should live their life instead of the law. Of course I will disagree with that. As should you. You have (I presume) Australian citizenship. As citizens of this country we obey and uphold the law. He may be obeying it, he's not upholding it. I am upholding it. I respect his religious freedom. I respect his right to free speech and yours. You are getting a harsh lesson that there consequences to dribble, and consequences to peddling another law over the one you are a citizen under.

That is correct - they are public holidays for all members of the public. If it was declared that only Christians could observe these holidays and as an atheist you took them off, then that would be hypocritical.

We live and benefit greatly from being part of a pluralist society. For our society to be successful, greater tolerance is required of dissonant voices. While I may disagree with Folau's interpretation of the bible because it is based on a modern interpretation of the original text(s) in Greek and Aramaic in which there is no mention of female homosexuality and male homosexual practice is in relation to married men having sex out side of marriage hence a form of adultery. But, having said that Folau's beliefs appear genuine and he seems happy to leave the final decision to God rather than advocating any earthly action. Recently, Australia voted in a non compulsory vote 62% in favour of allowing single sex marriage. This places Australia at the top end of other countries that have had similar votes and is something for which I am proud. However, trolling people who disagree is bullying, it has become a method of silencing dissent and is nothing more than pressure to conform to an acceptable/majority thought. At this time of year particularly, we should be rejoicing in our hard won freedoms and way of life and be mindful of the sacrifices made by others from which we benefit every day. The treatment of Folau and Ablett is and should be called out as un-Australian.

........much of the Australian relationship with 'religion' is cultural, rather than any impressionability to a fundamental type dogma that is inherent of all religious institutions. That said, I sense an insidious groundswell of 'religiosity' throughout Australian society, evidenced in our less than secular politicking today. In that respect are we more American than we care to admit? I say we most certainly are, in more ways than one and have long been......

The public outcry about Israel Folau's comments is so far from reality that it's hard to know where to begin the rebuttal. Homophobia is, supposedly, a fear of homosexuals. Firstly,there is no logical basis for connecting the expression of statements that homosexuals have a eternal destination in Hell with hate speech or of fear of them. If homosexuals are also atheists, then they don't believe in God and His purposes and shouldn't care in the slightest about such statements. The University of Sydney Law School include this definition of hate crime in their Australian Hate Crime Network list , although anything as sloppy as this wouldn't have passed muster in any essay I ever submitted. "Hate crime is generally understood as crime and abuse that is motivated or shaped by prejudice or group hatred. This tends to include prejudice on the grounds of race, religion, ethnicity, gender, sexuality and disability." If we substitute "speech" for "crime", we can see how the word "hate" has been introduced to engender unthinking compliance in the readers - if that's hate and everyone says it is, then we should hate the haters. The rational observer cannot claim to know if Folau is prejudiced or motivated by hate. Perhaps ,then, Israel Folau is guilty of vilification ? Or discrimination? The NSW anti-discrimination law defines vilification as "a public act that could incite or encourage hatred, serious contempt or severe ridicule towards people because of the above characteristics." Is telling people that they're going to Hell any of these things? Folau has expressed an opinion which is unpopular with many people. He is not calling for public executions as in Iran or stoning, closer to home in Brunei, but pointing out that a book that he believes in, written over more than a thousand years has some strong messages about human behaviour and its consequences. It appears that most people weighing in on this issue think that homosexuals can't look after themselves or defend their orientation adequately, unlike,for instance, adulterers, liars and atheists

Indonesia, a Muslim country, has a national holiday for both Christmas and Good Friday. There are 40 million Christians in Indonesia, a country of 266 million, and it would seem that Indonesians have a greater respect for religious traditions, generally, than we do in Australia.

What law has Izzy broken? Why hasn’t he been charged by the police for “not following the law?” You haven’t thought through your position deeply. You’re proselytising because it’s what you believe. You’re therefore applying double standards ie it’s ok for you to proselytise but not for someone you don’t agree with!

I was only following orders. How many times in history have we heard that? I think you’re hiding behind the law and using it as an excuse! I believed in God not because of fear of going to hell but because that is where the evidence points.

Has the media yet asked any Hawks fans why they booed Gazza yet? It could have been that he is a just a good player that Hawk fans love to hate. The way 7 were going on about it during the game was nauseating.

What is funny is that only Australia and NZ that celebrates Good Friday as a public holiday. I still cannot understand why you cant have a beer on Good Friday which is still prevalent in NZ (+Easter Sunday) and in WA (unless a substantial meal is ordered). France, Spain, Italy etc its treated as a normal day and they're predominately Catholic countries. I'm an Atheist, but think its hilarious how everyone gets offended by Izzy and Gazza.

Of course radio segments are planned. To suggest every word is scripted is ridiculous. They would spend more time writing the show than the show itself. Segments are planned but if you don't think most of what Ed does is ad lib, you don't know the fellow.

Phobia means to have a fear of. Izzy doesn’t fear homosexuals. The word homophobia has been hijacked and twisted.

So the bible is homophobic, do we ban Christians from public life??

Sure. And apologied and not done it again. It's not hard to be a decent person. Not sure if you know how radio shows work. But all segments are planned. Saying wrong things because it's all you can think off, points to the fact you've not a very nice person. Nothing more.

You know what i find most offensive about Christianity? Your continued defence of a 2000 year old book written by 4 blokes who for all you know had the same connection to "god" as Pauline Hanson. A book that actively encourages discrimination and hatred because 1 guy MIGHT have said something along those lines a few thousand years ago. How many people have died leading miserable lives because some dude in ancient times decided to announce god came to him and said divorce is bad? How many kids have killed themselves because 1 dude decided it wasnt ok to like other dudes? If you want to be Christian and live your life by the teachings of the bible then by all means go ahead - but please start using your brain... after all doesnt the bible suggest its ok to shack up with 12 year olds??

Not sure that's correct though.

... Which is a homophobic post. Quoting a homophobic comment without rebutting it (pardon the pun) is homophobic in itself. No hiding behind someone else. Cut the excuses.