NRL expansion must still be considered by ARLC
By Beowulf, 12 Sep 2012 Beowulf is a Roar Rookie
- Tagged:
- Central Coast Bears, Greg Florimo, North Sydney Bears, NRL, Rugby League
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Greg Florimo, CEO of the Central Coast Bears, has made a direct appeal to the rugby league community for assistance in bringing the question of expansion back to the table.
Recent polls suggest that around 90% of fans want expansion. After 10 years of trying, the Bears at least deserve the right to present a bid submission.
Edmund Burke, the prominent 18th Century Irish statesman said “all that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing. Do not allow evil to triumph. Do not do sit by and do nothing.”
With New Zealand rights and digital contracts set to reap the ARLC an additional $200m or thereabouts, the game is looking at a net result of $1.25 billion.
A great result which provides ample resources to secure existing clubs’ futures and massively increase grassroots support for junior and country rugby league.
Channel Nine claim not to be prepared to pay more for an additional game – but should that preclude expansion? Not if any prospective bids can add net value to the competition.
The acting CEO of the ARLC, Shane Mattiske, has stated that expansion is still possible if it can be proved a new entrant will not require additional funding and can strengthen grassroots involvement in the game.
The Bears tick both boxes.
The Rugby League Week poll released last month suggests 92% of fans want expansion, and of these, the Central Coast were overwhelmingly favoured by 46%, with Western Australia next on 29%.
These were the two leading contenders. The rest failed to garner much support: Central Queensland 13%, Brisbane Bombers 5%, Wellington 3%, Papua New Guinea 2% and Ipswich 2%.
Just as importantly, the favourite ground of fans to watch the game is Bluetongue (26%) ahead of Suncorp (21%), with no other venue over 10%.
This poll followed the News Limited poll a week prior which found WA and Central Coast neck and neck as overwhelming favourites for expansion.
These results aren’t an anomaly – they have been consistently repeated year after year, and every year Bluetongue fills to or near capacity to watch whatever scraps are thrown the Central Coast’s way.
Back to the ARLC’s newly stated position on expansion. In substance, this is nothing new.
John Quayle mentioned the key criteria months ago – an existing stadium, low costs, finance, demonstrated corporate and fan support.
After examining the Bears bid he said it’s a no brainer. He argued that they should be in, and put in urgently or the game would lose its player nursery on the Coast.
This is already starting to happen, with junior numbers down on the Coast. There can be no expansion to non-heartland areas if we can’t secure the player talent that will be fielded by any new teams.
The lowest cost model is obviously the CC Bears, as the infrastructure is in place, there is over 100 years experience in running a major league football club, and costs for the majority of visiting teams are minimal.
The only other low cost model (though not as low as the CC) would be a Suncorp based side. As for Quayle’s other criteria, the Bears are fully funded, obviously have a dedicated existing support base and are fully booked by significant corporate sponsors upon license grant.
With John Singleton potentially losing interest in rugby league, the Bears can buy the rights to the stadium they built, lock out prospective competitors and become a true community model – importantly, they own the playing rights at the stadium for the rest of the decade.
When looking at grassroots football (the other criteria stated by the ARLC) all three of Central Coast, western corridor and Central Queensland would achieve that mission admirably.
Though it would be desirable to add an extra game, to expand the League doesn’t need two teams entered simultaneously. The idea of staggering entry a la the AFL has enormous merit, particularly as the strongest of the bids on the newly stated criteria (the Bears) is ready to go now.
This would allow the ARLC to assist a less prepared entrant for 2016 entry.
Having two additional sides operating successfully at low cost before negotiations commence for the next TV deal would automatically increase the size of the subsequent outcome.
Also, adding the Bears now allows the Commission to make a healing and unifying statement that truly ends the Super League War.
With Cronulla’s position now apparently secure, calls for a relocation to the Coast are silenced.
All but the most naive acknowledge there can never be a stand-alone Central Coast side due to the lack of a corporate base on the Coast – the Bears bring not only their supporters, but the third largest corporate region in Australia behind Sydney CBD and Melbourne to the table.
For the Coast, it’s the Bears or nothing. As per Illawarra, to have a presence they need a linkage with a traditional supply route.
John Grant says the game is about the fans. The fans are the customers. The customers demand that expansion is back on the table.
Do you have what it takes to become a sports writer? Write for the roar
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September 12th 2012 @ 12:38pm
turbodewd said | September 12th 2012 @ 12:38pm | Report comment
You dont determine expansion choices by fan polls, you do it by the numbers, i.e the dollars.
Expansion is all about converting new hearts, mind and wallets to an NRL team. A team which will attract new viewers, juniors and crowds.
NSW/ACT already has 11 teams – to add yet another (CC Bears) so close to Sydney would be absurd. The AFL would sigh with relief.
Qld, WA and NZ must all come before another NSW team.
September 12th 2012 @ 12:54pm
Beowulf said | September 12th 2012 @ 12:54pm | Report comment
All the points you raise are the reasons the Bears should be included – or at least ahve the chance to present their bid. The mantra ‘there are too many teams in NSW’ is absurd. If a product can add value then there’s no limit. Look what happened to the highly congested inner Sydney area when Souths were readmitted against the Roosters wishes……crowds went up, memberships went up, merchandise sales went up…for the Roosters! Rivalries are what drives the game in NSW, and a Foundation Club that has pre-built rivalries with Manly and Newcastle can only be positive.
Guess what – FTA and Fox viewership is below East Coast averages on not only the north shore but Central COast, and they are down on what they were before the Bears were kicked out. Gallop himself said over 40,000 fans were lost when the Bears were punted – add them and their kids and you have instant growth, not manufactured franchises with no natural development.
September 12th 2012 @ 1:04pm
turbodewd said | September 12th 2012 @ 1:04pm | Report comment
Beowulf, you are passionate about your cause. Perhaps you can reveal where you live and your relationship to this matter. Im just some punter from Canberra who wants to see the NRL product brought to NEW markets. Its a good product and with a bit of solid marketing you can gain new hearts and minds.
In 2010 I became a fan out of nowhere of the UFC so people can adopt new sports.
Now the AFL have the brains, bravery and dollars to plonk 2 new teams deep in NRL territory with 20-year plans. Should we respond by putting one in our own backyard? Seems like a weak response.
September 12th 2012 @ 2:11pm
Beowulf said | September 12th 2012 @ 2:11pm | Report comment
Sure, Q.1 I’m involved with a junior League team on the lower north shore and volunteer for the Central Coast Bears.
Q.2 Build forts in your own territory to secure your territory before crusading in enemy territory is the thinking….
September 12th 2012 @ 7:39pm
mick h said | September 12th 2012 @ 7:39pm | Report comment
no turbodewd with regards to the afl they have turned their backs on western sydney with the gws giants playing 3 games a year in canberra people will not commit. they are also abandoning blacktown as a training centre.
in the nrl me must expand to the central coast and perth.
September 12th 2012 @ 1:03pm
B.A Sports said | September 12th 2012 @ 1:03pm | Report comment
Agree. You could do a poll of those polled to find out how many of them consider the NRL Footy Show to be high quality entertainment, and when 85% say it is great, you realise you have polled a bunch a people with not much of a clue.
As for John Quayle
“John Quayle mentioned the key criteria months ago – an existing stadium, low costs, finance, demonstrated corporate and fan support” – Interesting that he didn’t consider “first grade players” as an important criteria to fill an expansion first grade team… but then, this is the guy who previously expanded the league beyond its means….
September 12th 2012 @ 1:07pm
turbodewd said | September 12th 2012 @ 1:07pm | Report comment
Good point. Quayle and Ken Arthurson expanded the league to an absurd 20 teams by 1995 and left the league ripe for News Ltd to easily come in and almost take the whole thing over. News won, but there were many casualties.
I mean is this the NRL or the NswRL???
September 12th 2012 @ 2:12pm
Col Quinn said | September 12th 2012 @ 2:12pm | Report comment
No! The AFL will sigh in relief if the ARLC does not put a team in the Central Coast, which has a population of nearly 300,000. It is a growth region in NSW. If the ARLC does not put a team there, it is an open invitation to the AFL. Australia’s population hugs the east coast. Approximately 1 in 4 Australians live between Batemans Bay and the Queensland border. This is why the AFL is targeting NSW. When you add in the Queensland Coast, approximately 1 in 2 Australians live from Batemans Bay to Cairns. The ARLC must, as a matter of urgency, tie down the Central Coast and Perth, then Central Queensland with a second Victorian team, based around Bendigo. After having secured teams in Central Coast and Perth 2013/2014 and Central Queensland and Bendigo 2014/2015, the ARLC should target Wellington (NZ) and even perhaps a South African franchise. First tie down where most of Australia lives, the east coast.
September 12th 2012 @ 8:26pm
Rob9 said | September 12th 2012 @ 8:26pm | Report comment
Is that a typo or did you say an expansion team in Bendigo in 2 to 3 years time?
September 12th 2012 @ 10:10pm
Col Quinn said | September 12th 2012 @ 10:10pm | Report comment
you bet, target population areas
September 13th 2012 @ 5:58am
Rob9 said | September 13th 2012 @ 5:58am | Report comment
100,000 people in an AFL dominant area where RL doesn’t get a look in. It’s not as simple as putting teams where people are. The Storm have got Victoria covered for the foreseeable future.
September 13th 2012 @ 7:38am
Col Quinn said | September 13th 2012 @ 7:38am | Report comment
G’day Rob9,
Surprisingly there was a RL comp in this region of Victoria up to the late 1960s. It was a victim of the VFL/VFA war, when the VFL started to take over the code and then call itself the AFL. With the AFL now concentrating on other states it appears to have taken its eye of the ball in Victoria. Some Victorian competitions are struggling for funds. A well funded move into central or northern Victoria could be interesting.
September 13th 2012 @ 8:35am
JZ said | September 13th 2012 @ 8:35am | Report comment
perth is a no brainer 1.5 million people and a strong junior league presents, we suport games played over here even when its not our team. Wa will be next for a team
September 13th 2012 @ 6:47pm
Rob9 said | September 13th 2012 @ 6:47pm | Report comment
Hi Col. I still don’t think this justifies Bendigo as an NRL expansion area. Certainly not within the 2 to 3 years. Expansion policy needs to follow the key rule of putting teams where a large number of people that want one are located. Not just putting teams where people are. There are almost 2 million people in Perth and although it’s an AFL heartland, there’s clearly a percentage of that large population that would support an NRL team to make expansion there worthwhile. 100,000 is about 18 times smaller than the population of Perth and I’d guess that the percentage of RL fans in Bendigo would be smaller than a place like Perth where a large east coast expat population exists. The immediate expansion areas that should be on the ARLC’s radar include Perth, Brisbane 2, Gosford and Wollongong (fulltime team). In the longer term they should look at Adelaide, Rockhampton, the Sunshine Coast, Cairns, Coffs Harbour and Mackay. For mine, Bendigo would be decades away if ever. In fact I’d suggest other non-heartland areas such as Darwin and Geelong before Bendigo. There’s just nothing about that area that screams ‘put an NRL team here’ and I believe any attempt to do so would result in throwing money at a black hole.
September 13th 2012 @ 9:07am
Col Quinn said | September 13th 2012 @ 9:07am | Report comment
JZ, agree Central Coast and Perth in 2013/14
Col
September 13th 2012 @ 7:43pm
JZ said | September 13th 2012 @ 7:43pm | Report comment
i never said central coast, i said it was never going to happen the bears were gone.
September 14th 2012 @ 12:55am
81paling said | September 14th 2012 @ 12:55am | Report comment
18,000 fans on average per NRL game, 8,000 financial members (x $20 min for a team that does not exist = $160K) 2 x stadiums that have 20,000 + crowd capacity, 7000 juniors in the area, 95 members who have so far contributed over $5500 each i.e more than half a million dollars total and the Central Coast Leaugue’s plus North Sydney League’s behind them each earning a post operating profit of on average $7m per club. These r the numbers and therefore there r no problems.
September 14th 2012 @ 5:13am
Old Hand said | September 14th 2012 @ 5:13am | Report comment
Apostrophe Man strikes again – League’s?????
September 14th 2012 @ 5:14am
Old Hand said | September 14th 2012 @ 5:14am | Report comment
Apostrophe Man strikes again – League’s?
September 12th 2012 @ 12:42pm
Hamish said | September 12th 2012 @ 12:42pm | Report comment
A News Ltd poll says no competitor to the News Ltd owned Broncos. Who would have thought??
Who is going to subsidise the Storm when News Ltd stops and the big three retire??
September 12th 2012 @ 2:07pm
Beowulf said | September 12th 2012 @ 2:07pm | Report comment
All polls in whatever format, whatever media proprietor have the same results over 5 years. The Bears have the popular support – not sure how even our opponents could deny that.
September 13th 2012 @ 10:34am
Renegade said | September 13th 2012 @ 10:34am | Report comment
Sorry mate,
The fact that bluetongue was named the best ground to watch league at when probably less 1% of league fans have actually watched a game there makes it pretty dodgy….
I have a funny feeling that the CC Bid team might have asked for all bears members to heavily influence the online poll you quoted.
Just have a look at the responses on the roar…..just about everyone says Perth is the best option.
September 13th 2012 @ 8:13pm
Beowulf said | September 13th 2012 @ 8:13pm | Report comment
I have no doubt you’re right that the BEars supporters got on and voted, as they ahve for every other poll. the sample was 22,000 for the Telegraph poll and unsure re RLW, but its normally 4-5,000. Surely sufficent sample sizes to remove much bias, though I’m sure we skewed the data a bit!
But isn’t a passionate and committed supporter base exactly what the ARLC should be looking for? Do they want to disengage these people?
September 12th 2012 @ 12:51pm
stanza said | September 12th 2012 @ 12:51pm | Report comment
Always felt bad about the plight of the Bears. Can anyone enlighten me on when the Northern Eagles were wound down, how was it that the team reverted to Manly and not Norths?
September 17th 2012 @ 10:20am
Burgo87 MWSE said | September 17th 2012 @ 10:20am | Report comment
In 2002 the team was still the Northern Eagles but internally the North Sydney Bears board members had pulled out and half way through the season they stopped playing home games in Gosford (as a result of a sharp decline in crowd attendances). Max Delmege’s cash injection saved the Northern Eagles from insolvency but with the intention of reverting back to the Manly-Warringah Sea Eagles name and colours for the 2003 NRL season.
The North Sydney Bears wanted to become the Central Coast Bears for the 2003 NRL season but the NRL told them that they would prefer to keep the Central Coast open for an existing Sydney team to relocate to (particularly the Cronulla Sutherland Sharks or the returning South Sydney Rabbitohs, the latter came very close then Russel Crowe and Peter Holmes a Court saved them in 2006).
September 17th 2012 @ 5:11pm
Bring Back the Bears said | September 17th 2012 @ 5:11pm | Report comment
Thanks Burgo, I could never find a straight answer as to how and why the Bears disappeared completely after the merger. This makes sense. I just can’t believe a bigger deal wasn’t made of it at the time.
September 12th 2012 @ 12:52pm
turbodewd said | September 12th 2012 @ 12:52pm | Report comment
I think Greg Florimo should actually try to make the Brisbane Bears a reality and use the Norths-owned Seagulls club as a homebase. They can represent south Brisbane. This team would have fans when they visit Sydney. Its a good combination.
Today NSW/ACT has 1 NRL team per 700,000 residents
Qld has 1 NRL team per 1.5 million residents
NZ has one NRL team to cover 4.5 million people
Perth has 1.7 million people and no team.
Blue Tongue Stadium, as the crow flies, is closer to, say, Brookvale Oval than Penrith or Campbelltown. A team in Gosford is virtually another Sydney team.
September 12th 2012 @ 12:58pm
Beowulf said | September 12th 2012 @ 12:58pm | Report comment
The ARLC has three options with the Bears – admit them, extinct them or encourage a ‘relocation’ a la Sydney Swans….only if they were told you will be extinct obviously would the concept of a rebadged interstate Bears be even looked at – its a distraction only until the ARLC make a strategic decision on direction.
September 17th 2012 @ 10:36am
Bring Back the Bears said | September 17th 2012 @ 10:36am | Report comment
Unfortunately Beowulf, while I wouldn’t be opposed to the Bears relocating again, I can’t see this happening. If the ARLC announce that NSW is a no go in terms of expansion then all the work the CCBears put in to the bid would be undone. And while Greg Florimo has been unwavering in trying to get the Bears readmitted, I’m sure starting that process again would be pretty daunting.
The only possible way I can see that working is if the Bears align themselves with another bid e.g. Brisbane, Western Corridor, Perth or Central QLD. But by the time the ARLC make up their mind, there is also the issue of the other bids being too far down the track to want to rebadge themselves.
September 12th 2012 @ 2:42pm
JZ said | September 12th 2012 @ 2:42pm | Report comment
seagulls is on the border of Qld-Nsw. how could they represent south Brisbane when their home ground is 35 minuets south of the gold coast home ground
September 17th 2012 @ 9:55am
Bring Back the Bears said | September 17th 2012 @ 9:55am | Report comment
He’s talking about the Wynnum-Manly Seagulls, not the Tweed Heads seagulls.
September 12th 2012 @ 4:43pm
Col Quinn said | September 12th 2012 @ 4:43pm | Report comment
turbodewd,
Do you come from Sydney? In Sydney we travel dont travel by crows. Trains, buses and cars are the normal option. The Central Coast is not part of Sydney. The travel time to the Central Coast is around an hour as it is nearly 79 kms from Sydney. It is another geographic region that the ARLC needs to own.
September 12th 2012 @ 10:02pm
turbodewd said | September 12th 2012 @ 10:02pm | Report comment
In Sydney you think NRL = NswRL. Blinkered.
September 12th 2012 @ 1:02pm
Calcio said | September 12th 2012 @ 1:02pm | Report comment
Perth and the Bears are the obvious choices and have been for a decade.
Anything else will be a mistake for league.
September 12th 2012 @ 2:58pm
JZ said | September 12th 2012 @ 2:58pm | Report comment
Perth is a big yes every one in League know’s this BUT ! really the bears ?
Come on evey one the Bears are done and dusted
Question why where the Bear kick out the comp ?
Answer- There are three main reasons, for one it was the lack of Support all of their fans gave in the time of need such as bums on seats. secondly the pour facility and state of the ground it was going down hill fast because of the lack of cash and no one really cared at the time not untill it was too late.
So shame on you it is all the bears fans that caused their demise, and before i get a new one ripped for my troubles i am a bears fan but im also a realest.
what happened to the brisbane teams in the Qld comp when the broncos turned up GONE ! their have been team in newcastle long before the knights were their but now GONE ! . the bears should be in the NSW cup thats it .
so let the hating begin
Hey while were at it lets bring back the Newtown Jets
September 12th 2012 @ 10:51pm
Beowulf said | September 12th 2012 @ 10:51pm | Report comment
Your missing a few points!
1. The Bear were guaranteed survival by Arthurson who assured them their position was guaranteed if they stayed loyal in the Super League War, when everyone could see that as soon as Manly stayed, the Bears should have gone Super League. They stayed out of loyalty.
2. The Bears were guaranteed survival if they relcoated to Central Coast. A rich club, they spent their dough on that assurance by building the stadium at Gosford. That guarantee was also reneged on.
3. The Bears were told after the Norhtern Eagles fiasco they’d be in next…again, reneged on.
The Bears are financially stronger now than they were back then, in fact they’re stronger than most NRL Clubs, unlike all those clubs you mention who have gone…and those clubs didn’t face the disgraces mentioned above. Proves we are resilient and determined to right a wrong.
This is why Flo is calling on all people who feel the Bears were treated unfairly to sign the petition http://www.change.org/petitions/arl-commission-bring-back-the-bears-2
they deserve at least the chance to state their case. If thats rejected, so be it. But if they don’t even let the Bears present their bid, then the game can go to hell.
September 12th 2012 @ 1:07pm
The Greatest Game Of All said | September 12th 2012 @ 1:07pm | Report comment
Sorry but no more NSW teams, Perth first and foremost.
September 12th 2012 @ 1:12pm
Redback said | September 12th 2012 @ 1:12pm | Report comment
Perth will fail and suck funds away to keep it afloat same as what the storm do. League is not a national let alone an international game get over it. Stick to your strengths which will mean central coast and a second brisbane team.
September 12th 2012 @ 1:28pm
Maroon Blood said | September 12th 2012 @ 1:28pm | Report comment
Hmmm, do you actually understand what the term “expansion” means? Certainly isn’t to add more teams to areas with teams already. And what is your conviction that a Perth bid would “fail” based upon? Lack of corporate support? Lack of crowds? Lack of grass roots support? If those are your criteria then I would venture that you have false information.
September 12th 2012 @ 3:11pm
JZ said | September 12th 2012 @ 3:11pm | Report comment
my friend i live in perth and League is alive and well . and we want a team badly, 20,000 to the last game in perth should say we are ready
September 12th 2012 @ 3:22pm
Maroon Blood said | September 12th 2012 @ 3:22pm | Report comment
I too am a resident in the Land of Sand and it does irritate me that these East Coasters seem to think that they are the only ones in the country who follow League. As the turnouts to the two games played here this year show, we are here in numbers AND there is a small but extremely strong junior comp here as well. Bring on the West Coast Pirates (Haargh!! Me Hearties!! Pieces of Eight!! Avast there ye land lubbers etc etc etc)
September 13th 2012 @ 9:45am
Col Quinn said | September 13th 2012 @ 9:45am | Report comment
I hope the Perth bid succeeds but Pirates, surely there is a more Ausssie name than pirates!!!!!
September 13th 2012 @ 12:09pm
JZ said | September 13th 2012 @ 12:09pm | Report comment
Yer Pirates is a bit on the nose. why not the oilers or Miners, sand pipers
September 17th 2012 @ 10:01am
Bring Back the Bears said | September 17th 2012 @ 10:01am | Report comment
Pirates is horrible. Should be West Coast Magpies and bring back another much loved franchise. The benefit of bringing back franchises like this is that when the teams play away in Sydney (which will be about 50% of the time) you already have a great fan base to tap into who will attend games.
September 14th 2012 @ 4:47pm
clipper said | September 14th 2012 @ 4:47pm | Report comment
JZ – if the AFl gets 20,000 to their game in NZ next year will they be ready for a team there?
September 17th 2012 @ 11:30am
Crosscoder said | September 17th 2012 @ 11:30am | Report comment
If 14,000 attend a trial match between the Storm and Broncos in Hobart Clipper,does that mean an NRL team would be suited there? The answer is no.
September 12th 2012 @ 3:08pm
Naught said | September 12th 2012 @ 3:08pm | Report comment
Perth only failed last time due to Super League. Perth will be 1st cab off the rank when expansion comes and I would happily put money on it being a success.
September 12th 2012 @ 3:15pm
JZ said | September 12th 2012 @ 3:15pm | Report comment
sorry mate but its this narrow mindedness that will keep us behind ALF all the time. with the cash we now have the time is righ t for Perth and brizzy 2
September 12th 2012 @ 3:18pm
Maroon Blood said | September 12th 2012 @ 3:18pm | Report comment
Alf who??
September 12th 2012 @ 5:35pm
JZ said | September 12th 2012 @ 5:35pm | Report comment
LOL yes even in summer bay Leagues got a foot hold
September 12th 2012 @ 4:47pm
B.A Sports said | September 12th 2012 @ 4:47pm | Report comment
“League is not a national let alone an international game get over it.” hmmm Maybe you should take the NATIONAL Rugby League to court for mis-representation! You could make some money….
September 13th 2012 @ 12:09pm
JZ said | September 13th 2012 @ 12:09pm | Report comment
smell
September 12th 2012 @ 5:54pm
Crosscoder said | September 12th 2012 @ 5:54pm | Report comment
Based on what?Perth crowds for trials and NRL games have been consistently around the 15-20,000 mark.The finances behind the Perth side are far greater than a few NRl sides at this stage,with more to come on entry.
All clubs if you like, are kept afloat by virtue of the annual grants,so that is a nonsense argument.
The Sotrm pay for themsleves by their very presence in the Vic capital.
Perth was not a failure last time,having to pay all the accommodation and travel costs for visiting teams,was ludicrous.
League is not a national game,because of SL and stupid decisions in the past.Forward thinking management expands not contracts.
Your last line is indicative of the inward thinking,that has held the code back for ages.Too scared to put their toes in the water.
September 12th 2012 @ 6:15pm
Hamish said | September 12th 2012 @ 6:15pm | Report comment
Perth had player retention issues last time as do the Force now so something to overcome…
September 12th 2012 @ 6:41pm
Crosscoder said | September 12th 2012 @ 6:41pm | Report comment
Considering the SL war sprang up the first week the Reds played ,it was understandable the players were nervous.It had nothing to do with coaches.Players go to Townsville,Melbourne,Auckland even Canberra,I don”t therefore believe retention would be an issue.More so with a much bigger salary cap and the living environment.
In fact it has been reported by the Perth bid team,there have been many enquiries from current NRL players.
The Force had a couple of different issues to contend with.
September 12th 2012 @ 1:24pm
JonD said | September 12th 2012 @ 1:24pm | Report comment
Top two choices should be Brisbane and Perth (in that order IMHO). It is sad to see the Bears go but that’s life. The superleague war is over. That finally ended with the establishment of the ARLC commission and Nine/Foxtel giving up first and last rights on bidding for TV rights. Readmitting the bears won’t achieve anything in that regard.
The real aolution is to:
1. Expand the region of Manly so it includes the entire North Sydney area
2. Expand the region of Newcastle so that it includes the Central Coast area.
Whether that can or will happen is a different story. But ideally that would be the way to go.
September 12th 2012 @ 2:04pm
Beowulf said | September 12th 2012 @ 2:04pm | Report comment
Trouble is JonD that Manly are quite willing to let the 3 junior clubs on the lower north shore die – they only want Asquith and the rest can fall, as they don’t have any traction on the north shore. As for the Central Coast, we shall just see the drift away from league in junior numbers continue while ever there is the Mariners only to support. With reduced junior numbers playing league, all teams that cherrypick the area will suffer in the end, especially Manly.
September 13th 2012 @ 9:53am
Mals said | September 13th 2012 @ 9:53am | Report comment
Manly is gaining traction with the lower north shore especially with the young school age generation. I have cousins & family friends that live in Mosman & Neutral Bay & plenty of these kids support Manly. Yep everyone loves a winner & marketable players like Wolfman & Cherry Evans.
September 13th 2012 @ 8:19pm
Beowulf said | September 13th 2012 @ 8:19pm | Report comment
But the kids followed St George before that, and next year they will follow Canterbury or Rabbitohs. Agree manly due to proximity will have a higher % than most, but unless the parents are engaged with the game (and most long term nth shore residents aren’t without the Bears), the kids support won’t be bolted on.
If the Bears bid is rejected, agree in 20 years time what tiny remnants of RL support on the north shore remains will predominantly support the Sea Eagles IF they are still in Sydney. But we’re talking inconsequential numbers – 99% of kids here will be supporting the Swans or Waratahs or Sydney FC or CC Mariners.
September 14th 2012 @ 3:38pm
JZ said | September 14th 2012 @ 3:38pm | Report comment
boost crowds in Sydney, you could give away tickets and it wouldnt make a difference to the crowed numbers. sydney just arnt as passionate about their teams. not until its to late and they have been dropped just like the bears the rabbits should have been doped, im glad their back though
September 17th 2012 @ 5:18pm
Bring Back the Bears said | September 17th 2012 @ 5:18pm | Report comment
I disagree JZ, Sydney are very passionate about their sports teams. The issue is (in terms of my friends anyway) the majority of people go to the pub to watch the game. Great view, cheap beers, and transport isn’t an issue.
September 17th 2012 @ 5:28pm
NF said | September 17th 2012 @ 5:28pm | Report comment
BBTB
I don’t consider going to pub to watch the game is ‘support’ get to the game itself that’s actual support something Sydneysiders don’t understand. There definition of sports support is different to everyone else in Australia.
September 12th 2012 @ 1:25pm
LRR said | September 12th 2012 @ 1:25pm | Report comment
I would love to see the bears back in.
Sadly it looks like they will be the Tasmania of the AFL. Quite clearly the best bid, however more concern in getting dots on the map and corporate dollar.
September 12th 2012 @ 1:27pm
turbodewd said | September 12th 2012 @ 1:27pm | Report comment
Best bid? Do you know how small Gosford is? These people already watch NRL on TV, it wont add anything to the viewership figures.
September 12th 2012 @ 1:57pm
Beowulf said | September 12th 2012 @ 1:57pm | Report comment
Gosford plus north shore = 1 million. Thats why its called the BEars, and no, they don’t watch NRL as much as they should, hence they add value.
September 12th 2012 @ 3:05pm
JZ said | September 12th 2012 @ 3:05pm | Report comment
isnt the north shore Sydney ? so what your saying is the bears will be another Sydney club after all
September 12th 2012 @ 8:33pm
Beowulf said | September 12th 2012 @ 8:33pm | Report comment
Think St George Illawarra as the closest model, though everything will be based on the Coast aside from 1 game NS Oval and thousands of fans and major corporates located in northern Sydney who are financing the bid – these corporates won’t sponsor anyone but the Bears, so there can be no claims of cannibalisation by existing teams.
September 12th 2012 @ 1:58pm
Beowulf said | September 12th 2012 @ 1:58pm | Report comment
I see Tasmania is next in line for AFL franchise, as well as perth 3, so there is hope!
September 12th 2012 @ 3:20pm
JZ said | September 12th 2012 @ 3:20pm | Report comment
Tasmaina will not get a team for at lesst 20 years Hobart only has 100,000 and Launceston only has 80,000 people impossible to give them a team.
September 12th 2012 @ 4:41pm
Ian Whitchurch said | September 12th 2012 @ 4:41pm | Report comment
JZ,
In 2011, Bruce Stadium in Canberra averaged 12 419 people to see Canberra games.
In the same year, York Park in Launceston averaged 15 716 people to see Hawthorn play.
Just saying.
http://stats.rleague.com/afl/crowds/vn_york_park.html
http://stats.rleague.com/rl/crowds/bruce_vn.html
September 12th 2012 @ 6:44pm
Crosscoder said | September 12th 2012 @ 6:44pm | Report comment
There is the commercial side to consider,when smaller populations are involved.Marketeers like to appeal to the masses,not the scattered few.
September 12th 2012 @ 8:41pm
JZ said | September 12th 2012 @ 8:41pm | Report comment
yes your right but compare how many games where played at these stadiums Launceston only has 4 games a year where as Canberra had i think 14. so thats 3,929 per game for Lonnie
September 14th 2012 @ 1:18pm
JZ said | September 14th 2012 @ 1:18pm | Report comment
also most of those fans come across from Melbourne to watch the hawks play so we could half that crowd figure
September 12th 2012 @ 1:31pm
In the Know said | September 12th 2012 @ 1:31pm | Report comment
The next team needs to incorporate what all of these bids can offer into one offering – established fan base and loved brand (can’t start from scratch), corporate support, in place player base, operational social/leagues club, in place stadium and an ability to generate revenue during the bid, build and play process. The one thing missing is the ability to grow fan and membership base outside of it’s immediate geographical area. The AFL suffered this with Port Adelaide and Freemantles entry. There is a strong rumour that a second bid is coming out of Brisbane in the coming days that can facilitate this and has a very strong case in how it will engage an already in place fan base in QLD – wait and see!
September 12th 2012 @ 2:24pm
Beowulf said | September 12th 2012 @ 2:24pm | Report comment
If you think the Bears were dudded, add your voice to the following – http://www.change.org/petitions/arl-commission-bring-back-the-bears-2
In 4 days, so far over 3,500 league fans from all clubs have joined – the Bears deserve at the leasst the chance to state their case for admission.
September 12th 2012 @ 6:00pm
Jz said | September 12th 2012 @ 6:00pm | Report comment
Ok Beowulf, ill give you a red hot tip, you will have to do a bit more then that a petition. 3500 people signing a petition wont get the NRL’s attention. you need to sell the Bear to the people that mean the most and thats the fans and people of the area. make them live and breath the bears. do a membership drive you will need about 20,000 people to be members to have any chance. also a great club needs a great club house. to help fund your teams re entry into the comp make people bye the Bears jersey the more of those you have walking the streets the better. the NRL needs to know that the people will still be at the games in ten years time if your given a licence
September 12th 2012 @ 8:36pm
Beowulf said | September 12th 2012 @ 8:36pm | Report comment
All done JZ, though we only have 8,000 financial members, same as some existing NRL clubs! Gallop said if we could get 5,000 he’d become a fan. Mt Penang has been set aside and partly funded by the State Govt as best-in-state facilities. Think Centre of Excellence but viable. Already sold 1000′s of Bears jerseys/training shirts etc. Support is the easiest thing to prove and its where we are light years ahead of other contenders.
September 12th 2012 @ 8:42pm
JZ said | September 12th 2012 @ 8:42pm | Report comment
well best of luck to you
September 12th 2012 @ 2:59pm
Australian Rules said | September 12th 2012 @ 2:59pm | Report comment
“In the Know”…
PORT are currently struggling but not because they’re the 2nd team in a pre-existing heartland area. They’re struggling because they are at an all time low in terms of onfield AND offield performance. Happens to most sports clubs in Australia that wrestle for airtime and corporate dollars in a limited marketplace.
But…they still have 36,000 members and about 20,000 average crowds.
FREMANTLE have 42,000 paid-up members and average about 34,000 per game.
Both these teams have enriched those areas by creating cross-town rivalries. The decision to put 2nd teams in Perth and Adelaide reinforced Australian Footy as the dominant force in both cities.
That is what a second team would do (in time) to Brisbane. Yes to Perth, but Brissie2 is a must…crazy there’s only 1 team in that town – the Broncos have had it too good for too long.
September 12th 2012 @ 3:01pm
Australian Rules said | September 12th 2012 @ 3:01pm | Report comment
btw…no way to Central Coast. I understand the nostalgia but it’s not the right call.
September 17th 2012 @ 5:22pm
Bring Back the Bears said | September 17th 2012 @ 5:22pm | Report comment
I’m not opposed to that idea, just as long as it’s not the Bombers. Looking forward to seeing what the Western Corridor propose (as they would be playing out of Suncorp as well. QRL is obviously rich in history, why wouldn’t the new bids tap into it?