The Fiji team celebrate their victory over New Zealand in the final match of the IRB Sevens rugby tournament. AFP PHOTO / Patrick Hamilton
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Question: If a 13 or 14-year-old Australian boy or girl decided that rugby Sevens was their ticket to the Olympics, what exactly are the pathways involved in getting there?
I first asked this question on Twitter about a month ago out of curiosity, and it was the response I received that prompted this piece being put together today.
Though I didn’t receive any answers of knowledge and experience, it was fascinating to see the number of, “Good question, I’d be interested to know that too” replies that came back.
Everyone clearly knows that the inclusion into the Olympic program means that there is a new genuine career pathway in Sevens rugby now available, but quite how you get there is not so well known.
Outgoing ARU CEO, John O’Neill, laid out the big plans and expectations for Sevens back during the Olympics, boldly declaring, “We will have serious gold medal ambitions. It will be a rugby-led revival in Rio.
“We will see a significant uplift in the attention, finance and development to the sevens program. We will look at creating a squad of full-time sevens players.”
That, of course, is not too different to what is in place already. Australian Sevens coach, Michael O’Connor, has had a squad of specialists under his watch for several years as they travel the world playing in the IRB World Series, the new season of which kicked off this weekend just gone on the Gold Coast.
Well-known legs in Wellington, Hong Kong, Las Vegas, and Dubai, among others, are also on the itinerary.
So, wondering how this development will take place, and interested to know what the pathways are, I fired off some emails to the ARU and the five states, which are obviously the key areas where the game is played in Australia.
Happily, I received detailed responses from Queensland, Western Australia, and a very enthusiastic Victoria. The ACT got back to me too, but only to advise that any local development is done under the guise of the ARU High Performance Unit, who have a couple of development guys based at Brumbies HQ.
Disappointingly, I received no response from New South Wales at all.
The ARU themselves got back to me initially, and were quite happy to provide a response, but I suspect that developments late last week surrounding their boss moving on may have taken priority.
For what it’s worth, the states that did respond all suggested that the development work and promotional activities around Sevens undertaken by the national body HPU are generally very well done, which is excellent to hear. Other people involved in promotion of individual tournaments that I spoke to said the same thing.
Perhaps the best example of this – aside from the Gold Coast event, obviously – is the recent camps and trial road shows held around the country hoping to unearth the next wave of female players. From all reports, some very talented girls from all kinds of sporting backgrounds have been discovered.
Here’s what I found out from three simple questions.
1. Does [ARU/State] have documented pathways that are publicly available for aspiring and talented young players to follow, and if so, what are they?
Collectively, the answer here appears to be ‘no’. While the ARU website features a dedicated Sevens section, and it does include a plethora of news and information about Sevens tournaments around Australia, there’s nothing that a young player could point to and say, ‘OK, this is how I can get there.’
Likewise, the state websites carry snippets of news from local Sevens carnivals and events too, but no documented pathways as such. Certainly, the pathways are there around the country, and the states are rightly proud of what they’re doing to introduce kids to the game via Sevens, but perhaps more needs to be done make these pathways more widely recognised and accessible.
For the moment at least, it would seem our kids just need to be playing the game in some shape or form, and to then participate in the various school and age-group carnival and tournaments that are held. And if they show some promise, the Sevens people will spot them and introduce them to the HPU programs.
2. Can junior players (male and female) participate in regular, dedicated Sevens competitions for age groups in [each State]?
From all the responses I received, and even where I didn’t, it seems that the main vehicle for age group Sevens participation is through stand-alone carnivals and events, rather than regular competition.
Queensland have quite an extensive schoolboy competition structure in place, known as the Queensland Schoolboy Sevens Championships (the Q7s, from U12 to U18s), which comprise the best schoolboy teams in the state to have qualified through the various Q7s Regional Carnivals.
The Q7s are held in the lead-up to the Gold Coast IRB event. The Q7s winners go onto an ARU-run National Schoolboy Championships, and both events in the past two years have been won by Keebra Park High.
Queensland also introduced a Try Sevens program in 2011, which is also run in the lead-up to the Gold Coast tournament. Evidently my enquiries last week were well-timed, and the Queensland Rugby Union were understandably keen to tell me, “A record 16,297 students from 68 schools signed up to take part in the 2012 Try Sevens program, a 30 percent increase on the 12,495 students who participated in Try Sevens during its inaugural year in 2011.”
WA currently host events for both boys and girls, and across numerous age groups right up to U18s, who play for the James Stannard Cup, and the Debby Hodgkinsons Cup, both named for noted Western Australians to have played Sevens internationally.
Interestingly, RugbyWA also run Northern, Central, and Southern Primary Schools Sevens carnivals for Under-10s, 11s, and 12s age groups, which is great to hear just for the logistics that must be involved in running programs in the south and Perth right up to Newman, Broome, Karratha and Port Hedland as they do.
In Victoria, their Rebel Rugby development officers run cross-field Sevens events across the Melbourne metro regions, and these culminate in the School X Field State Championships.
Additionally, there is the Victorian Schools rugby union 7s competition, “our Private School competition which is akin to the GPS or CAS in NSW” and which is run at the beginning of the season. The winner of this will progress to the National Schoolboy Championships on the Gold Coast.
I know that there are several primary school and age group Sevens carnivals are run in the ACT, and the ARU Sevens website makes mention of several primary school Sevens competitions that were run across the Sydney area in September.
3. Does [ARU/State] have plans for regular school or club-based Sevens rugby competition in the coming few years?
Across the board, there is certainly a desire to have more Sevens competitions in place, be that through increasing the number of school- or age-based carnivals, or through the creation of regular junior and senior club competitions, even if as a pre-season thing.
All the responses acknowledge the role Sevens plays in introducing the game of rugby to kids in general. Queensland’s General Manager of Game Development, David Hanham, sees the prospect of growing the game through Sevens like this:
“Sevens Rugby provides significant opportunity for growth in our game and in its status as an Olympic sport for both men and women, participation across Queensland will continue to climb, as will the code’s opportunities.”
Down in Victoria, General Manager of Rugby Operations, Josh Philpot, echoed a similar theme, while also pointing to the need to work in conjunction with the ARU:
“We see 7s as a huge opportunity for developing and growing the game in Victoria and also another opportunity for our young players to reach their dreams of professional rugby, whether it be 7s or 15s. At this point in time, the pathway must be, and is, synonymous with the ARU pathway. The evolution to this will be increased focus and resources as a sampling and intro tool, and elite development.”
For the time being at least, the main vehicle for Sevens in Australia is going to be through the weekend tournaments, like those run in Darwin, Noosa, Queanbeyan, Byron Bay, Kiama and so on, but clearly more can be done to lift the profile of these events.
Craig Morgan, the Tournament Director for the upcoming Central Coast 7s, gave the ARU HPU guys a big wrap for their assistance and availability, but mirrored my own disappointment with the NSWRU:
“.. they are unfortunately inactive on the Sevens front in the eyes of many, but this coincides with NSW generally being viewed as Sydney-centric and having lost engagement with many within NSW … I don’t see why NSW and all Super Rugby franchises shouldn’t get behind Sevens in the interest of the overall game. If such bodies thought outside the square and embraced Sevens, [they'd see] it creates another major platform to attract participants to the game at all levels.”
While the concept of ‘more can be done’ is hardly a new one in Australian rugby, I was still pleasantly surprised at the amount of activity around the country to grow the game through the Sevens format. Obviously, some states are doing more than others are, but I’m also really happy to hear that the ARU are leading the way, too.
So the message for the 13 and 14 year-old boys and girls out there is to get involved however you can. Ask the question of your school, or your local club, and find out where and when your local carnival or Sevens event is held.
Sevens definitely can be your ticket to the Olympics, and indeed a career in rugby, but the pathway isn’t quite as obvious as following a yellow brick road. A pathway of sorts is there, though, even if you have to do a little bit of digging.
Brett McKay is a former non-tackling scrumhalf and not-quite-1st Grade middle order stalwart. A rugby and cricket expert for The Roar since July 2009 (having joined in Sept 2008), Brett has written for Inside Rugby and Cricket Australia, and is also PLAY Canberra's rugby correspondent. He tweets from @BMcSport
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October 16th 2012 @ 2:58am
Johnno said | October 16th 2012 @ 2:58am | Report comment
This is how I see it.
-Lots of countries can get good fairly easily with the right financial investments, like the Olympics you spend big you get good fairly easy. You spend little you drop down the rankings pecking order.
-This is like T20 cricket in many ways. Something totally new and potentially big has just entered the sporting scene/market.
And teething problems will happen. Know onw really knows what type of pathways/programs to have. No one can predict the future and know one knows yet how big it will get 7evens, and what programs to do.
-And all the questions in this article are the “Unkown questions” with no awnsers yet.
-A few schoolboy tournaments have been organised eg at Scot’s college a GPS school in sydney, and one up Nudgee college way a GPS school in Brisvegas.
-And stuff like 7evens the joey Johns playing T20 cricket for NSW won’t happen with 7evens.
As sevens as many will know has been around for years at least 30 years . So know mickey mouse joey johns or Usian bolt rumoured cameos.
-It is now becoming increasingly porffesional with full time contracted players in some coutnries eg England,USA,. And full time coaches eg England, NZ, Fiji,USA, Australia.
Just what is the appropriate pyramid, top down model pathways know one knows.
-What I do know is the IRB have increased the word sevens legs, and full time world series teams to 15 with a promo/relegation to the elite world series each year with 1 team losing there spot and another country gaining 1 spot.
-Good news for me is next 7evens world cup 2013 in Moscow will most likely not be the last. The IOC has put no demands on the IRB to close down the 7evens world cup, it can stay not he 4 years rugby cycle. And the IRB are deciding to keep it.
-The other issue why to keep the 7evens world cup is number of teams. At present at RIO 2016 like basketball only 12 teams allowed, where as world cup 7evens it is about 24-32. SO more teams will have a shot. Hopefuelly the IRB who want the IOC to increase the amount of teams at the games will allow it as 12 teams is too little. And host nation gets 1 spot so only 11 to go around. 12 is not enough spots for 7evens to grow adequately which is why 7evens world cup will most likely stay if more IOC spots ar not given.
-T20 cricket,7evens rugby, beach soccer and beach volleyball, 3X3 basketball which is also trying to get into Olympics at RIO 2016. All these spots have tremendous potential to expand new areas and markets into there sport. T20 cricket wants to get into olympcis too.
-So 7evens at this professional stage is very young and know one has the awnsers yet, I don’t know your guess is as good as mine what is the appropriate player pathways. Like T20 cricket has matured a lot and got rid of it’s mickey mouse antics eg Joey johns, and bubble gum attitude, it is focusing and working out pathways and tactical technical stuff.
-7evens Olympics over next 4 years to Rio 2016 will mature a lot too, and get rid of it’s teething problems eg player pathways, player welfare, how to make money out of it and develop specialist 7evens players and understand the sports specific sports medicine strength and conditiong side more.
-One thing you wont see is anymore is like in the 90′s players would just rock up after playing 15 a side with no training for sevens. Luke Morahan is a rarity and he copped an injury for his troubles further showing you have to understand the technical side and be sports specific conditioning to play 7evens at the elite level. Will 7evens be along term success I don’t know, signs a promising though it will get some market share in a fairly saturated aussy sports market. Going to be some Alan standford style 7evens tournaments big prize money winer takes all, and IPL type tournaments i reckon too around the world in some big tv markets.
October 16th 2012 @ 9:17am
Brett McKay said | October 16th 2012 @ 9:17am | Report comment
Johnno, there’s a lot of points here, and I’m not going to address them all, so let me just pick out one:
“And all the questions in this article are the “Unkown questions” with no awnsers yet.”
The questions might be somewhat unknown, yes – hence the reason and motivation for asking the questions, and putting together the article – but the answers are already out there and well and truly in place, albeit stronger in some regions than others.
Qld’s program looks far and away the most advanced, but there’s good work going on all around the place, including WA and Victoria, which I think is possibly the best news out of everything I’ve discovered doing this. That there two states, that really are developing rugby markets, are so enthusiastic and committed to introducing rugby to kids across their state. This is precisly what should be happening in the established makets, too..
October 16th 2012 @ 11:40am
sheek said | October 16th 2012 @ 11:40am | Report comment
Is this an opportunity to throw in Donald Rumsfeld’s known knowns; known unknowns; unknown knowns & unknown unknowns….. ?
October 16th 2012 @ 3:30am
Mella said | October 16th 2012 @ 3:30am | Report comment
I think there is an underlying problem in that how many kids actually know a thing about sevens? Its nearly non-existant on free to air tv and sports media. I would guess the ARU gets bugger all from FOX for showing the IRB sevens series. Why dont they forego that piddly revenue and offer the Gold Coast leg to the commercial networks for free. Sevens is more attractive than 15′s to non-rugby fans which is 95% of the sports following public in Australia, it should be a priority to get it on free to air TV.
October 16th 2012 @ 5:53am
Niccolu Machiavelli said | October 16th 2012 @ 5:53am | Report comment
Great point Mella. It could be an entry point for rugby on free to air.
October 16th 2012 @ 6:05am
Billy Bob said | October 16th 2012 @ 6:05am | Report comment
Actually, sevens could be the breakthrough that rugby needs.the logic would go like this-
-A free to air ad that promotes the game as a pathway to the Olympics
For talented, fit kids from 13 years up.
- A structured and articulated pathway for willing kids to follow, including registration as a 15′s player.
- A sevens scout employed by ARU for each junior comp age level.
- A regular seven’s national comp structured for all age groups to test a few of the. National comp (arc, apc) models under discussion for the 15′s.
October 16th 2012 @ 6:09am
Brett McKay said | October 16th 2012 @ 6:09am | Report comment
My sincere thanks to Samantha Broun from the QRU, Josh Philpot from the Melbourne Rebels, Nick Smith from RugbyWA, and Craig Morgan from the upcoming Central Coast 7s tournament for providing me with excellent detailed assistance in putting this piece together…
October 16th 2012 @ 9:35am
rl said | October 16th 2012 @ 9:35am | Report comment
and nothing from NSWRU… says it all really.
October 16th 2012 @ 9:59am
Brett McKay said | October 16th 2012 @ 9:59am | Report comment
RL, it was disappointing, and it’s easy to draw easy conclusions, I must admit. As I mentioned in the article, I was willing to give the ARU guys an out, given what went down there toward the end of last week..
October 16th 2012 @ 7:19am
Andrew C (waikato) said | October 16th 2012 @ 7:19am | Report comment
Brett, it seems from our view from the other side of the ditch that NSW is letting down the side ( Australian Rugby) in terms of what they contribute. I guess currently the Waratahs are a glaring example of this. Sevens rugby IS one way to grow numbers and unearth future rugby stars who will go onto international stardom. David Campese is a classic example . How many times did he star in Hong Kong? – plenty
. We in NZ have a deep and wide net uncovering talent galore within our country. Central to all this is Gordon Tietjens as coach, memtor, slave driver extraordinaire who is absolutely relentless in his pursuit of keeping NZ @ the forefront of world Sevens. I can highly recommend a read of the book ‘TITCH – Sevens Is My Game – The Gordon Tietjens Story’ (by Heather Kidd) published 2006 (with a lot more to be appended to it since
). …………….. Brett, apart from Campo, Sevens has a habit of unearthing talent that go onto be 15 stars. From an NZ perspective, look no further than JONAH LOMU, CHRISTIAN CULLEN, Eric Rush, etc. ……………………. if Australia doesn’t wake up and organise themselves properly in Sevens rugby, Rio will bypass you. But from what I saw on NZ’s Rugby Channel (all live all weekend from the Gold Coast !!), Michael O’Connor appears to have quite a bit of talent at present – all it requires is RESULTS in the World Sevens circuit – winners are grinners/winning breeds confidence !!! …………..cheers
October 16th 2012 @ 8:40am
Brett McKay said | October 16th 2012 @ 8:40am | Report comment
Andrew, there’s little argument Australia has kicked on in the Sevens format since Michael O’Connor took over as coach. He’s been able to build a squad of core players, and they’re starting to have success as they did in Japan last year. The fact they were disappointed and hurt by their performance against Kenya in in the QF is a good thing; hopefully it’s the motivation for them to work harder on their fitness, and on their concentration.
There’s no question that for Sevens to really take off in Australia, both the mens and womens sides need to performing a high levels, and ideally, winning titles. The girls, at this point, are probably well in front..
October 16th 2012 @ 8:06am
Paul Cully said | October 16th 2012 @ 8:06am | Report comment
Brett – Are Australia even guaranteed a place at the Olympics? I was at the Adelaide Sevens event last year and spoke to the IRB types and it was unclear.
At Rio there will be 12 teams. One will be Brazil. So 11 places are available.
But it Fiji, NZ, Samoa, Aus and Tonga are included, that leaves just six places for Africa, Europe, Asia and the Americas. Clearly that won’t happen, especially with the rise of Kenya, Spain, Canada, Argentina etc. So Aus might be fighting for one of 4 places from the Oceania region – or even three.
I haven’t followed the IOC’s policy on this since – has it been clarified?
October 16th 2012 @ 8:24am
Brett McKay said | October 16th 2012 @ 8:24am | Report comment
G’day Paul – I have to concede I wasn’t necessarily thinking of Rio as a target for our kids when I put this together, so I really didn’t look into the Olympic qualification side of things at all. Either way, I had always assumed there would be some level of qualification required for Rio, be that through a specific Q tournament, or whether it’s by IRB rankings at some point in time.
You make a good point about the fight for poistions though. I don’t know if it has been clarified, no, but you can’t imagine rugby at the Olympics with minimal (or no) representation from Africa, Europe or the Americas, for sure. You may well be right, the likes of Australia, NZ, Samoa, Tonga (you’d expect if Fiji are in the top 2 or 3 in the world, they’d be safe) might be fighting it out for only one or two spots..
October 16th 2012 @ 8:33am
Red Kev said | October 16th 2012 @ 8:33am | Report comment
If Jamaica can have 3 of the 8 spots in the 100m final at the Olympics why can’t the South Pacific Islands have 3 of the 12 Olympic slots for Rugby Sevens? It is simply an indication of the strength of that sport in that region.
October 16th 2012 @ 8:43am
Paul Cully said | October 16th 2012 @ 8:43am | Report comment
Jamaica could probably put 20 sprinters into the Olympics based on fastest times alone.
But the Olympics isn’t about that – it’s participation and all that nonsense.
My guess is Australia’s region will get 3 places, maybe 4 at a push. Europe will lobby hard for 3 spots, Africa likewise, and the USA and Canada will want in. Same with Argentina. Then there is China and Japan…you can quickly see how it’s going to be a squeeze.
October 16th 2012 @ 8:43am
Brett McKay said | October 16th 2012 @ 8:43am | Report comment
Kev, sports like rugby – as is the case with football, hockey, and so on – will only have limited places, and therefore qualification is required beforehand. Even Athletics has a limit for the number of runners you can put into an event from each country, based on qualifying times. The Jamaicans just happened to come through the heats and Semis in numbers for the 100m, which is obviously a little different to how the team events are run..
October 16th 2012 @ 8:52am
kingplaymaker said | October 16th 2012 @ 8:52am | Report comment
The IOC of course shouldn’t be unfair towards regions simply because they have a lot of teams. I must though say I think you could double the number of teams in the tournament quite comfortably, especially given that each match only lasts the blink of an eye.
October 16th 2012 @ 8:56am
soapit said | October 16th 2012 @ 8:56am | Report comment
limit on numbers from each country but not from each continent/region (you’re competing for your country not your region). do any other team sports do this?
kinda goes against the olympic spirit for me if they restrict which nations can get there. if you’re good enough it shouldnt matter where you’re from.
October 16th 2012 @ 9:51am
Paul Cully said | October 16th 2012 @ 9:51am | Report comment
All football World Cups use the same principle. The teams that meet every 4 years are never the 32 best in the world, just the best from all regions of the world.
October 16th 2012 @ 10:10am
soapit said | October 16th 2012 @ 10:10am | Report comment
but this is not the world cup paul. do any other teams sports do this in the olympics
(sorry if i wasnt specific the first time)?
October 16th 2012 @ 8:53am
Red Kev said | October 16th 2012 @ 8:53am | Report comment
To both Paul and Brett:
Fair point on the difference for team events, and I do agree the teams should qualify. But IF (and I realise this isn’t the case right now) NZ, Fiji, Samoa, Tonga and Australia formed the top five of the IRB sevens rankings, could you legitimately hold the Olympics and not include all five?
October 16th 2012 @ 9:02am
Brett McKay said | October 16th 2012 @ 9:02am | Report comment
Kev, I wouldn’t have thought so personally, but then we’ve seen events moved around schedules to suit prime time viewing times in Europe and/or the States, so stranger things have happened at the Olympics..
October 16th 2012 @ 4:22pm
AndyS said | October 16th 2012 @ 4:22pm | Report comment
It will be an interesting one, as Rugby has given up it’s 7s world cup for the Olympics. It would not be unusual for teams to be left out of the Olympics – have a look at the teams that have contested the soccer over the last few decades relative to the actual top teams in the world. Both hockey and soccer use region specific qualification tournaments to fill a specific number of slots assigned by geographical region. Too many good teams in one region; tough.
Harder to do with 7s though, as we don’t have regional comps. My expectation is they’ll use the 7s tour, although exactly how is anyones guess. Me, I’d take rankings in the year before the Olympics with:
- Host country
- 3 x Europe
- 3 x Australasia/Oceania
- 2 x Americas
- 1 x Africa
- 2 top ranked teams not already selected.
October 16th 2012 @ 8:47am
Darwin Stubbie said | October 16th 2012 @ 8:47am | Report comment
I thought O’Connor made some mention of it in an interview recently – re a timeline for Oceania qualifiers …. Based on last weekend Aust will struggle to be there on the men’s side …. I can’t see them in Rio when you factor in NZ, Fiji and Samoa
Overall I thought the standard on the weekend was pretty average – first tournament of course – but the kiwis were shocking both days yet still made the final with Fiji who came good toward the end had a large number of first up starters …. The next tier down is improving but, just as it is in 15s, depth is the killer for these sides
The question is of how much rugby will earn out of all this is how much do the players make by playing it … 7s will only grow if the players can make a very good living … It appears that 15s is still the money trian for the players …. Making the Olympics is all fine but in the end most follow the cash …
October 16th 2012 @ 8:55am
Red Kev said | October 16th 2012 @ 8:55am | Report comment
True, but as with all of Australia’s Olympic campaigns, I think the women might tear it up.
October 16th 2012 @ 9:04am
Brett McKay said | October 16th 2012 @ 9:04am | Report comment
Darwin, very valid points, and Michael O’Connor has said numerous times that he really only gets a guy for one or two seasons currently. It will be interesting to see what kind of Olympic money comes the way of Sevens in the next few years..
October 16th 2012 @ 10:13am
Ryan said | October 16th 2012 @ 10:13am | Report comment
Hey Darwin,
You’re right the Kiwis were off the pace but even still only Fiji were better than them, now that is saying something when a team like NZ can still make the finals with a relatively inexperienced team.
NZ lost this tournament last year but still went on to win the series so i wouldn’t read too much into it.
See below article in the NZ press today
http://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/rugby/international/sevens/7819066/Tietjens-to-bolster-All-Blacks-Sevens-squad
October 16th 2012 @ 1:34pm
Andrew C (waikato) said | October 16th 2012 @ 1:34pm | Report comment
Hey Ryan, I noted that the Kiwis played WELL BELOW their usual best ……….. and noted it was the new faces that weren’t quite gelling with the established/older players. Maybe Gordon was going to keep the newbie players on the field regardless – to give them a trial by fire, so to speak. I thought NZ struggled all through the 2 days @ Gold Coast and Gordon will have plenty of ammunition in the form of video analysis to ram home their onfield frailties. Nevertheless, it was only the first tournament. I was impressed with the way the Kenyans played in particular – they really attack the ball both on the ground and in a maul situation and appear to have strong upper body strength (their coach Mike Friday had a bommer day on Sunday
), even minnows like Spain have improved out of sight. Of the individuals, I was taken with the speed and side ‘step’ of the young England Captain (if he’s used properly in olde establishment England, he might go onto being a star in the 15 code !!)……………….. BUT Fiji were absolutely dominant when they clicked into gear in the finals part of the tourney.
October 16th 2012 @ 1:29pm
Mella said | October 16th 2012 @ 1:29pm | Report comment
I’ve read bits and pieces about the qualification process. The top four teams on the IRB sevens circuit (the 2014/15 season) qualify automatic. Its also based on regional tournaments. I guess there will be 3 spots for Oceania. That means if the sevens circuit finishes say 1) NZ, 2) Fiji, 3) England, 4) Samoa, 5) Australia, then it would be curtains and Australia wouldn’t even be able to qualify. If only two teams from Oceania are in the top 4, then at the Oceania tournament there will still be one spot available.
October 16th 2012 @ 9:28am
Grimmace said | October 16th 2012 @ 9:28am | Report comment
Brett,
Can’t say I’m surprised you got no response from NSW. Same response I got while President of a club down there with everything I tried. NSW- Newcastle, Sydney Wollongong.
Being a former hooker/THP, my one issue with 7′s is that it loses the ‘game for all shapes and sizes’ ethos. But I agree a great way to get kids involved, and the Mums are less likely to be put off. Why not 10′s for schools, give us guys with a proper physique a go!
October 16th 2012 @ 10:00am
Brett McKay said | October 16th 2012 @ 10:00am | Report comment
Grimmace, it was disappointing not to hear from NSW, for sure, especially when they were one state that does post news about schools carnivals from time to time. The others were more than happy to spread the word but NSW, like seems the easy conclusion to draw on so many things, missed the boat on this one.
I do take your point about the ‘game for all shapes and sizes’ ethos, that’s quite valid. It was interesting to see Ed Jenkins – who plays on the wing for Sydney Uni when he does get back to the XV game – was packing in the scrums during the 7s games on the Gold Coast. It’s certainly the game more suited to the ‘athletes’ within rugby, with only limited requirement for ‘footballers’..
October 16th 2012 @ 10:40am
eagleJack said | October 16th 2012 @ 10:40am | Report comment
Brett, very interesting that you mention the “athletes” aspect of 7s.
I went along to the Gold Coast on Sunday with a couple of mates. It was my first 7s tournament.
The first thing you notice is that speed is a prized commodity. Obviously speed is important in 15s as well, but you get the feeling that a player with limited rugby skills could be picked for his speed alone. The Scottish winger was basically scoring at will due to his incredible speed and huge spaces available in 7s.
So it got us all thinking about the potential of the USA at this level of rugby. With the lure of an Olympic Gold medal, we may very well see talented track athletes in the collegiate system moving into 7s rugby. Or even College Football Running Backs/Fullbacks/Wide Receivers etc, who would have the added bonus of possessing footballing skills, move into the game for the simple reward of winning an Olympic Gold. It would make the USA near impossible to beat.
Anyway, great article. It will be interesting to see how the different countries react to the prospect of competing in the Olympics. Hopefully the Aussies don’t get left behind and take it seriously. Cause if the USA choose to take a professional attitude and recruit gun track athletes, then my money will be on them.
October 16th 2012 @ 11:41am
Brett McKay said | October 16th 2012 @ 11:41am | Report comment
EagleJack, from memory, the US team on the Gold Coast included a recent convert from track sprinting, who had only been playing rugby for 12 weeks prior to the tournament. So I think your thinking is already something of a reality, and it’s clear that the States are taking rugby Sevens seriously, which is great for the game in a relatively untapped market.
I think the US are a bit of a sleeping giant in rugby in general..
October 16th 2012 @ 3:19pm
Mals said | October 16th 2012 @ 3:19pm | Report comment
Yeah he was lightening quick & not bad at tackling either.
October 16th 2012 @ 10:37am
Brett McKay said | October 16th 2012 @ 10:37am | Report comment
Grimmace, just on 10s, too, one of the states (and I think it was WA) made mention of some 10s carnivals in outlining their development work too, and I agree, 10s would be just as good a vehicle to get the kids involved. It’s actually surprising to hear the number of 10s carnivals that pop up around the place..
October 16th 2012 @ 1:10pm
Grimmace said | October 16th 2012 @ 1:10pm | Report comment
I ran one for a couple of years. We picked 10′s over 7′s as it catred to rounder individuals.
October 16th 2012 @ 4:11pm
AngrySeahorse said | October 16th 2012 @ 4:11pm | Report comment
Agree Grimmace. Personally I would have liked to have seen 10′s in the Olympics & not 7′s. Gives people of slightly larger body types a bit more of a level playing field too.
October 16th 2012 @ 5:38pm
Kuruki said | October 16th 2012 @ 5:38pm | Report comment
Who wants to watch a bunch of fatties run around? Guys like Victor Vito. Liam Messam. Hosea Gear have all been successful sevens players once you start getting bigger then guys like this your into the tight five. Nobody wants to watch the tight five run around trying to showcase skill and speed.
October 16th 2012 @ 10:08am
Hoy said | October 16th 2012 @ 10:08am | Report comment
If I was looking around for potential players, as a scout that is, I would head to as many touch tournaments as possible.
Fitness, ability, skill etc. Might be a bit light, but someone like Shaun Jonhson at the warriors, Benji Marshall etc, all played touch as youngsters, and think what their skills would be like in a 7s team.
Just a thought anyway.
October 16th 2012 @ 10:30am
rl said | October 16th 2012 @ 10:30am | Report comment
Hoy, based on what I have seen of O’Connor’s squad, they don’t lack talent. The issue is, as Brett has mentioned, there isn;t enough $$$ in sevens to retain them in the squad for longer than a couple of years.
There’s a lot of players whose skills don’t necessarily suit the 15 man game (e.g. Shannon Walker), or who can’t find a permanent home in one of our S15 teams, but would be a waste to see them ply theri trade in overseas club competitions. And I’ll put it out there – I wonder if Drew Mitchell is becoming the Shaun Tait of rugby? (better suited to the short game) At the very least, and without causing too much disruption to the 7′s squad, I’d prefer to see Mitchell make his way back into nick by playing 7′s (he’s supposedly fit for this weekend’s Bledisloe – I see another disaster looming). I reckon players like Ioane would benefit greatly from time playing 7′s also.
In short, we need to see more money in 7′s or it will continue to be a side-show.
October 16th 2012 @ 10:36am
Brett McKay said | October 16th 2012 @ 10:36am | Report comment
Hoy, Georgina Robinson had a great article in the SMH yesterday, on the type of players the round-the-country women’s trials have unearthed: touch players do feature prominently, as you point out, but there’s been AFL players, ice hockey players, and even martial arts practitioners to show some useful skills convertible for the game of rugby: http://www.smh.com.au/rugby-union/ruck-and-roll-womens-sevens-all-the-rage-20121012-27i3x.html
October 16th 2012 @ 11:17am
jameswm said | October 16th 2012 @ 11:17am | Report comment
What about strongly built sprinters? Melinda Gainsford, who grew up playing tackle rugby with her older brothers on their family farm, would have been our greatest female rugby player. She was strong, tough, and bloody fast.
Have a look for girls struggling to make it in sprinting, on the cusp at natinal level, and target them too.
October 16th 2012 @ 11:36am
Hoy said | October 16th 2012 @ 11:36am | Report comment
RL, we have never been great at 7s though have we? A bronze at the Commonwealth games in KL, and a silver in Delhi, and a few tourny wins here and there.
It is a bit like 20/20. We just aren’t quite the force we should be.
I keep trying to read that article Brett, but it freezes my computer for some reason. I think it is a good idea, to grow the sport, but there are a few comments on another article today, does this mean they are looking at converting athletes to footballers? Can 4 years of playing really make good rugby players? I am still learning after 20 years. 7s is niche, there is no doubt, but they need base skills, or in certain situations, they will not have the smarts, skills or experience to get themselves out of those situations. It would have to be some pretty intensive training that is for sure.
October 16th 2012 @ 12:51pm
Brett McKay said | October 16th 2012 @ 12:51pm | Report comment
Hoy, that’s exactly what they’re looking to do. Josh Philpot from the Rebels told me about 15 girls from about 100 trialists in Victoria advanced to the next stage of camps, and included in that 15 were sprinters, footballers of both round and Sherrin variety, all sorts of skill sets.
I believe they’re hoping to find around 30 players who will then get the real intensive training to become rugby players..
October 16th 2012 @ 1:22pm
Red Kev said | October 16th 2012 @ 1:22pm | Report comment
I reckon Ellyse Perry should play 7s at Rio too – she already plays every other bloody sport.
October 16th 2012 @ 1:26pm
Brett McKay said | October 16th 2012 @ 1:26pm | Report comment
since she’s going to be in the neighbourhood anyway, you reckon Kev?!
October 16th 2012 @ 2:40pm
Red Kev said | October 16th 2012 @ 2:40pm | Report comment
Exactly Brett – as long as the women’s soccer and the women’s rugby sevens are scheduled at different times there’s no reason she can’t play both! Then after the Olympics she can head off to a T20 World Cup just for good measure.
October 16th 2012 @ 10:29am
jameswm said | October 16th 2012 @ 10:29am | Report comment
Brett
I’ve got a 12yo boy who plays private school 13As, Sydney club A comp (12s), representative rugby (reps – state carnival) etc. He’s perfectly suited to 7s.
However apart from one poorly attended local pre-season carnival, I can tell you first hand the NSWRU does bugger all for 7s.
What Aussie rugby doesn’t understand is that playing a lot of 7s improves the 15-a-side skills. Is it a coincidence that the Kiwis offload, support the ball, mnove the ball etc so well, when they play a lot of 7s growing up and as young adults? I can assure you it is not.
They need to have serious 7s comps for all the age groups, and I’d actually say that for agex 10-14 they’re just as important as the 15-a-side game. As I’ve said on here before, at club training we do a “keeping the ball alive” drill/game (more attackers than defenders) that mimics the benefits from 7s – backing up, offloading. Watch how static the Aussie attack is, how their instinct is to get ready to clear out or wait for the next hitup.
Sydney needs proper 7s comps in place. Club or District, graded or not. It’s a crucial yet undervalued part of the young players’ development.
October 16th 2012 @ 10:58am
rl said | October 16th 2012 @ 10:58am | Report comment
agree james – reading you comment about our static attack, I’m wondering if our blokes are just getting too accustomed to playing against stacked defences, and falling into the habit of low risk hit-em-ups? That’s not to suggest there’s less risk in 7′s – you’re in just as much trouble if you get isolated. But our guys just seem to have lost that instinctive ability to (a) see a chance and (b) actually take it, rather than stopping for a committee meeting.
As I said above, I reckon Diggers would be a much more rounded player if he’d done a decent stretch in 7′s.
October 16th 2012 @ 11:43am
Brett McKay said | October 16th 2012 @ 11:43am | Report comment
James, your thoughts here are almost identical to what Craig Morgan of the CC7s and several other tournament organisers told me about the level of NSWRU involvement..
October 16th 2012 @ 1:37pm
Andrew C (waikato) said | October 16th 2012 @ 1:37pm | Report comment
James, get a copy of Gordon Tietjens book that I mentioned above……………. might give you and your son an insight into how we do things in NZ in 7s