Wallabies move up rugby Test rankings

By AAP,

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    The Wallabies have jumped up two spots to third in the latest world rugby rankings.

    Australia claimed second place in the Rugby Championship, behind world No.1 New Zealand, to move ahead of Ireland and South Africa.

    Michael Cheika’s side recorded two wins, two draws and two losses in the recent four-nation tournament that featured the All Blacks, Springboks and Argentina.

    The All Blacks extended their lead at the top, over second-place England, after an unbeaten Rugby Championship campaign.

    Argentina remain in 10th place after losing their past six Tests.

    WORLD RUGBY RANKINGS:
    1. New Zealand – 95.52
    2. England – 90.14
    3. Australia – 85.59
    4. Ireland – 85.39
    5. South Africa – 85.03
    6. Scotland – 82.47
    7. Wales – 81.73
    8. France – 79.63
    9. Fiji – 79.48
    10. Argentina – 76.93

    © AAP 2018

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    The Crowd Says (62)

    • October 10th 2017 @ 9:57am
      Phast Phil said | October 10th 2017 @ 9:57am | ! Report

      Not sure if we are better than we give credit for, or the bar is really low, Clearly, constant playing against the All Blacks so often dulls one’s perspective on how relatively good we are.

      I tend to think we have improved through the year, some players have come on, Coleman, Hodges, Uelese, Dempsey, Genia and Beale have made good returns. Still the fundamental issues in terms of game management, temperament and core skills means that a slip to 6 is more likely than a rise to 2

    • October 10th 2017 @ 10:00am
      PiratesRugby said | October 10th 2017 @ 10:00am | ! Report

      Well, there’s obviously no problem then. We’ve lost to Scotland and managed only 2 wins against 10th ranked Argentina out of 6 games in the TRC. Do the rankings take into account how well we’ve been training?

    • October 10th 2017 @ 10:24am
      Fionn said | October 10th 2017 @ 10:24am | ! Report

      How are we above Ireland? The only worse loss than us they’ve had over the last 18 months is Wales. Meanwhile, they’ve beaten New Zealand and England, as well as the Boks in South Africa, while we have not.

      Such a strange ranking system.

      • October 10th 2017 @ 12:00pm
        Misha said | October 10th 2017 @ 12:00pm | ! Report

        Its actually very scientific – takes into account relativity in rankings, home ground advantage and most important long term trends – so one swallow does not make a summer results – don’t have that much impact. My only issue is that it awards double points for World Cup games which doesn’t make a lot of sense…

      • October 10th 2017 @ 12:17pm
        Dubaikiwi said | October 10th 2017 @ 12:17pm | ! Report

        But its real close between these two and Ireland will more than likely move ahead during the six nations. Is third/ fourth a fair place for both teams, yes and good on them both.
        Do they play each other on the end of year tour im not sure but that may clarify the points position as well.

      • Roar Guru

        October 10th 2017 @ 12:34pm
        Train Without A Station said | October 10th 2017 @ 12:34pm | ! Report

        Fionn as mentioned by other it’s based on trading of points, etc.

        Now I could be wrong but I think the movements are mostly driven by defeating teams above you. So this year Ireland have lost to Wales and Scotland below them, whilst we only lost to Scotland below us. Ireland also lost to SA twice last year as well as France, that may have been below them at the time.

        Plus due to our regularity that we play the 3 of the traditional top 5 (England, NZ and SA) our results are generally somewhat played down in the context of other tier 1 nations.

        Take Ireland for example. Since the RWC they have played England twice, SA 3 times and NZ twice.

        In that same period we have played NZ 5 times, with 1 game to go, England 4 times and SA 4 times.

        • Roar Rookie

          October 10th 2017 @ 5:30pm
          piru said | October 10th 2017 @ 5:30pm | ! Report

          This makes sense given that NZ seems to never move from 95 odd – as the top team it’s hard for them to beat someone above them.

          • October 10th 2017 @ 11:26pm
            Rugby Tragic said | October 10th 2017 @ 11:26pm | ! Report

            piru, I couldn’t be sure but believe that NZ must win by 15 points or more to gain any meaningful points.. in particular away wins

            • Roar Guru

              October 11th 2017 @ 12:12am
              Harry Jones said | October 11th 2017 @ 12:12am | ! Report

              @piru and Rugby Tragic

              The ABs win in Cape Town earned them 0.31 points.

              But isn’t that only because it was in SA?

              • October 11th 2017 @ 12:21am
                Rugby Tragic said | October 11th 2017 @ 12:21am | ! Report

                Away wins accumulate ranking points as I understand, not sure of the number (perhaps I should do some research … 🙂

              • October 11th 2017 @ 3:50pm
                Cuw said | October 11th 2017 @ 3:50pm | ! Report

                yes. and had they won by over 15 , the points would be more ( albeit in fractions).

                there are 3 conditions basically – the rank of ur opponent, home or away (or neutral) , margin of victory.

                if i recall correct NZ did not gain anything despite beating the Argies , coz they are ranked so low.

                also its a zero-sum game – when one side gains points , the other side loses the same points.

            • October 11th 2017 @ 4:22am
              soapit said | October 11th 2017 @ 4:22am | ! Report

              not sure if gaining any kind of points would be meaningful from nz’s current position

        • October 10th 2017 @ 11:25pm
          Rugby Tragic said | October 10th 2017 @ 11:25pm | ! Report

          The other point is that the NH sides at this minute are dormant, no games so no ranking points to win or lose .. when the 6N starts and there is no activity in the SH, the opposite will happen.

          • October 11th 2017 @ 4:23am
            soapit said | October 11th 2017 @ 4:23am | ! Report

            yes its a bit of a funny sytem that way, fairly skewed one way or the other for at least half the year

        • October 11th 2017 @ 8:05am
          Bakkies said | October 11th 2017 @ 8:05am | ! Report

          SA were still in the top three when Ireland played them last year.

      • October 10th 2017 @ 1:05pm
        P2R2 said | October 10th 2017 @ 1:05pm | ! Report

        NZ played them twice and thumped them in the game in Dublin…

        • October 11th 2017 @ 8:05am
          Bakkies said | October 11th 2017 @ 8:05am | ! Report

          No they didn’t thump them.

          • October 11th 2017 @ 9:43am
            BBA said | October 11th 2017 @ 9:43am | ! Report

            I though they did?

            That’s why the Irish were so upset about the hits.

            Glad that it has finally been settled.

          • October 11th 2017 @ 10:00am
            Jerry said | October 11th 2017 @ 10:00am | ! Report

            A 3 tries to none, 12 point away win would be considered a bit of a thumping by a team other than NZ, I suspect.

            • October 11th 2017 @ 12:00pm
              Fionn said | October 11th 2017 @ 12:00pm | ! Report

              If you look at the score, perhaps. If you look at the context of how the match played out Ireland were held up over the line multiple times, and only some incredible All Black scramble defence saved more tries (Barrett on SOB early on, for example).

              There was also the fact that Fekitoa wasn’t red carded, and he was subsequently banned, which was an admission by World Rugby that he should have seen red rather than yellow.

              The better team won in Dublin, but it wasn’t a thrashing by any means. It was a really class and quality test. One of the best of the year.

    • October 10th 2017 @ 11:09am
      DrTootr said | October 10th 2017 @ 11:09am | ! Report

      Well done Wallabies, keep moving on that upward trajectory and try to keep improving each match, that is all us Aussie fans can ask for. Who knows where we will be after the EOYT but I’m excited by some of these new players and the return to form of some of our older ones.

    • Roar Guru

      October 10th 2017 @ 5:05pm
      Harry Jones said | October 10th 2017 @ 5:05pm | ! Report

      Boklings take ABs to the brink; drop to 5th from 3rd. Dumb-Dumb de Allende has such power!

      • October 10th 2017 @ 10:34pm
        Mike Julz said | October 10th 2017 @ 10:34pm | ! Report

        The 57-0 might have something to do with the drop

        • Roar Guru

          October 10th 2017 @ 10:55pm
          Harry Jones said | October 10th 2017 @ 10:55pm | ! Report

          Actually, not much, because the loss was in NZ. The draw with OZ at home didn’t help. But it was the (one-point, incredible) loss at home that was the killer.

          • October 11th 2017 @ 4:24am
            soapit said | October 11th 2017 @ 4:24am | ! Report

            shows a few issues with the system there doesnt it.

            • October 11th 2017 @ 3:57pm
              Cuw said | October 11th 2017 @ 3:57pm | ! Report

              not really

              first of all u need to accept IDEAL only exists in dreams.

              then u need to see if the system provides a reasonable picture of the current situation.

              one big issue with rugger is , all dont play all on a regular basis , so it is difficult to be sure where exactly teams stand.

              for eg. NZ and Eng will not play untill end of next year. and then it is just one match i think.

              or the fate of FIJI , who play very little against top teams on a regular basis.

              the reality is some teams play against each other a lot and very little against some other teams.

              unlike in cricket , which is a very balanced system – simply becoz they play each other a lot more.

              • October 11th 2017 @ 8:16pm
                soapit said | October 11th 2017 @ 8:16pm | ! Report

                i think most system would have about the same result, nz way ahead and eng slightly ahead of a log jam,

                point is a system that you lose more from a home loss by 1 point than an away loss by 57 to the same team has issues. none of what you say addresses that.

                i agree that there likely wont be an ideal ranking system. this is why i dont put too much stock in it outside of extended trends like nz has at the moment. doesnt mean there arent issues with the system for those trying to derive significant meaning from it and Harry’s example illustrates this well. the issues remain regardless of you stating they dont based on the making an ideal system being difficult.

      • Roar Guru

        October 11th 2017 @ 5:56am
        Colin Kennedy said | October 11th 2017 @ 5:56am | ! Report

        What surprises me Harry is that the referee is taking all the heat and nobody’s talking about the fact that De Allende is a liability and in my opinion next to useless.

        • Roar Guru

          October 11th 2017 @ 10:21am
          Harry Jones said | October 11th 2017 @ 10:21am | ! Report

          He’s not a smart player

          • October 11th 2017 @ 5:42pm
            Rugby Tragic said | October 11th 2017 @ 5:42pm | ! Report

            DdA really looked the goods 2-3 years back. He has the ability to break a tackle, not sure what’s happened, a loss of confidence perhaps?

        • October 11th 2017 @ 10:42am
          BBA said | October 11th 2017 @ 10:42am | ! Report

          Agreed. The flak for the ref is only a “what if”. In the case that it happened in the first five minutes it would of had more impact. However in the context of the game what hurt the most was the three points which meant the Boks needed to score twice. And as they managed to score once DDA’s absence did not hurt so much.

          However only the staunchest of old school rugby supporters and one eyed South Africans would be arguing that it wasn’t a penalty.

        • October 11th 2017 @ 4:04pm
          Cuw said | October 11th 2017 @ 4:04pm | ! Report

          i think the ref is getting baked , simply becoz he did a top – down rather than a bottom – up.

          instead of thinking ” penalty – yellow – red ” , he went red – penalty.

          the card had no impact on the match – coz it was anyway a penalty.

          but the bigger issue maybe , there is no consistency at all in these cards.

          i dont know how or when or why “accidental” thingy came into these decisions.

          i thought the powers that be said any contact above shoulder is a minimum yellow and head contact is a red.

    • October 10th 2017 @ 5:08pm
      Blinky Bill of Bellingen said | October 10th 2017 @ 5:08pm | ! Report

      The good lady and I were only just talking about the rankings a few days ago, and I needed to confess to her that I did not know how rankings were arrived at, nor could I devise a system for rankings Frankly us jumping from 5th to 3rd has me totally confused, but I’ll take it. Later on I’ll Google to see if there’s an explanation of how it all works.

      I continue to be optimistic that the Wallabies will deliver consistently good performances, while at the same time wondering how we’ll roll Rugby powerhouses like New Zealand and England.

      • Roar Rookie

        October 10th 2017 @ 5:15pm
        Paul D said | October 10th 2017 @ 5:15pm | ! Report

        It jumps around so much because you could throw a tissue over 3-5. They are so close together.

        • October 10th 2017 @ 10:39pm
          Blinky Bill of Bellingen said | October 10th 2017 @ 10:39pm | ! Report

          Yep I can spot that. It’s how they arrive at the numbers that’s a complete mystery to me.

          Personally, and as a Wallaby’s fan I don’t like saying this, I feel like we’re anything other than 3rd best team getting around. I could not claim in all honesty that if we were to play teams 6-10th ranked, that we’d be a certainty.

          • October 11th 2017 @ 10:50am
            BBA said | October 11th 2017 @ 10:50am | ! Report

            It is what TWAS said a points trading system, so first and foremost if you lose you can not win points. You can only gain or lose points if you are within 10 points of an opponent, and if you are playing away 3 points gets added on to the home team.

            I don’t know the exact margin but whoever posted about margin is right that it is a factor.

            So if a team wins and they are within 10 rating points then they will get points.

            Accordingly what Harry said was correct that when AB’s play SA at home no points was on offer (i.e. AB’s 95 rating points + 3 = 98 vs SA approx. 85, difference of 13) however SA at home the rating point difference is (AB’s 95 vs SA approx. 85 +3 = 88 difference of 7 points).

            At home AB’s would only get rating points from playing England, everyone else it is just lose points. This is why it is tough to have a rating in the 90’s.

            • Roar Guru

              October 11th 2017 @ 1:06pm
              Train Without A Station said | October 11th 2017 @ 1:06pm | ! Report

              I think 15 points is the margin where the points trade changes.

              • Roar Rookie

                October 11th 2017 @ 9:24pm
                tsuru said | October 11th 2017 @ 9:24pm | ! Report

                I’m stunned by so many posters, whom I have seen to be knowledgeable on this site, floundering around saying ” I don’t know how this works.” Simply go to the World Rugby website and it is explained there. Here is the link

                https://www.worldrugby.org/rankings/explanation

                The system is not simple to apply without a calculator, but it’s set out there.

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