By Wally James -
May 31st 2009 @ 7:20am
2
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Mundine’s antics are just too much
Has anyone had enough of this bloke? Is he a good example for our children and young men?
His father was a gentleman and talented. In the recent fight, the son did not stand with the referee when the decision was announced.
He carried on like a five year-old when he found out he was the winner and did not shake the other fellow’s hand.
Has boxing come to this? Do we want the rest of the world to think he represents Australian boxing or any of us for that matter?
I am truly disgusted with this sort of carry on.
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(36)
Hugh Jarse said | May 31st 2009 @ 11:27am | Report comment
Completely agree.
May I also add that the fox commentary was an absolute disgrace.
Geale was the champion and Mundine the challenger, but they carried on as though Geale had never done anything of significance in his entire career. Andy Raymond in particular was so one-sided in his assessment of the fight that you would think that Geale didn’t land a blow at all. He is also extremely annoying and ignorant when covering the NRL on Fox.
I can only assume that this clown has some family ties to someone there. In my opinion, he has no place as a commentator in any sport.
Harry said | May 31st 2009 @ 1:03pm | Report comment
I too find Anthony Mundine’s behaviour and conduct unpleasant and often obnoxious.
That said Australia is a free country and he can conduct himself as he wishes, so long as he stays within the law. As with any boxer, he has an immense amount of physical courage and an undoubted dedication to this most demanding of sports. While I disagree with some of his statements and actions, he has the right to put his own viewpoint. Its often disagreeable, but occassionally not without validity.
From the reports of the fight his entourage’s behaviour wasn’t the best. That is a matter for the boxing authorities to act on and from the sounds of things they need to take some action. A real shame this distracts as it was a cracker of a bout to watch on the telly.
I often cite the Australia-wide glee and delight (including mine) when he was knocked out by the German boxer a few years back as an example that there are limits to Australia’s parochialism and one-eyed support of our sportspeople.
Gerry Faehrmann said | May 31st 2009 @ 1:03pm | Report comment
Fair dinkum Hugh Jarse and Wally James, you gotta NOT take ol’ Mundine seriously!
I have a Koori mate (well respected professional, Souths tragic etc) and he knows Choc – and he says privately he is a quite and humble man. The public persona of Choc Mundine is a done for promotion of Mundine and Sport.
Jason said | May 31st 2009 @ 2:22pm | Report comment
While I personally don’t like the bloke, there are few people who have (are doing) as much as he is for their community. His committment to dragging his race and his community out of the gutter his equalled by few. He is an exceptional role model for some… perhaps not your typical WASP. Oh yeah he has also achieved more that almost any other Australian sports person!
How about we all start focusing on his positive contribution and less on the BS that he uses for getting media attention
Hugh Jarse said | May 31st 2009 @ 2:43pm | Report comment
Gerry, yes we tend to get caught up in his antics and, as you said, take that side of him too seriously.
I agree also with Harry that this was a great bout. Both boxers were able to counter-punch their way out of trouble. I was happy to see that Mundine didn’t get on his bike again and backpedal away from his opponent. Credit where it’s due, Mundine looks the goods with not too many weaknesses in his technique [I'm no expert though].
That said, Daniel Geale must also rate highly to take it so strongly to someone as good as Mundine.
damos_x said | May 31st 2009 @ 5:30pm | Report comment
Wally, not to be rude about it but your name says it all. why not just come out with it & say you don’t like the bloke because he’s not your style rather than rave on about being a gentleman or who an athlete represents or the cliche of all cliches, what about the kids! yes he has ‘ a big mouth’ so just say you don’t like what comes out of it, & you may not act in the same manner but let’s see your life live on tv & see if every move you make shines with perfection. as for the kids, the bloke is a top class athlete so he has discipline & devotion to achieve a goal. he doesn’t smoke, drink or take drugs, in fact he has more good influence on kids not doing those things than most people so i assume you find that aspect disgusting too or possibly not but who wants to highlight the good bits when you are putting the boot in. role model ? i hear you ask, well i’d imagine that young aboriginal men could do with a man who tries hard to achieve both financial & spiritual success in his life as opposed to some of the influences they’ve had. all in all Wally i’m willing to put it out there that you are either a shit stirrer who just wanted to see how people would react to your post or you are pissed that you paid for PPV to see Mundine not get his come-uppance as you’d hoped.
Joe said | May 31st 2009 @ 5:49pm | Report comment
You are taking a very narrow view of Mundine if you base your opinion of him soley on his behaviour in front of the media. His real genius is ensuring he evokes a negative reaction from people like you – thus ensuring a healthy paypacket every time he fights.
Wally James said | May 31st 2009 @ 7:27pm | Report comment
damos
Thanks for your response. I will respond to it in the forthright fashion in which you responded to mine.
I don’t like the bloke. He’s not my style. I don’t like what comes out of his mouth. I would never act in the manner he does. If my every move was on TV it would not shine with perfection. No-one’s would. That is neither here nor there.
Mundine is not a top class athlete at all. Look at Pat Rafter, John Sattler, John Eales, Lionel Rose and Mark Taylor for example. None of them are loudmouths but they are fabulous representatives of their country. Mundine is far from any of them.
That you raise aboriginal men disgusts me. Not once did I raises it in my post. Neither should I. It is completely irrelevant. A person is objectionable or he is not and Mundine is. It matters not the colour of his skin.
Robbos said | May 31st 2009 @ 7:38pm | Report comment
Let me think, Gallen, Bird, Johns, Mason, Cousins, Carey & Warnie, I find their antics unpleasant, disgusting & far more worthy of displeasure from the public than Mundine. But the media has taken a line that he is the most hated sportsman in Australia. Yes some of his actions & big mouth gets him offline with alot of Australians, but he has not done what those mentioned above has done, which are truly terrible role models for their sport.
Glen Mahoulis said | May 31st 2009 @ 9:12pm | Report comment
How much of the negative public reaction to Mundine comes down to a dislike of ‘lippy’, combative aboriginals?
The indigenous person accepted by the general public tends to be submissive and shy, preferably well spoken, deferring to those in authority, who adopts or at least does not disrespect good western values, and who knows his place. Those who don’t subscribe to the dominant values and institutions, those who show open disrespect ie a very good proportion, tend to be shown contempt or just marginalised.
That’s just a thought, and it might not apply to Mundine or to those who don’t like him.
Leaving that aspect aside, is the dislike because he is a loud mouth, because he is not humble, because doesn’t pretend to be a normal punter, because he makes claims to greatness?
Where does this idea that sportsmen, in order for us to respect their athletic endeavour, have to also be humble and jovial and diplomatic? Perhaps you like those qualities in people in general? That’s great. But do you have an expectation that sportsmen in the public eye, who you occasionally see on TV, will satisfy your preferred personality traits?
If you do, you need to have a look at yourself and ask yourself why. If it’s because you think kids need heroes, do you know what indigenous kids think of Anthony Mundine?
I don’t expect boxers to have public profiles that are nice and meek and mild. I expect them to be a bit aggro, controversial, and self serving. And I don’t expect that their public profiles will be an indication of what they are like as people. They might be, but we shouldn’t assume.
For what it is worth, I have had in my professional life cause to experience the way Anthony helps people who have gone off the rails, those less fortunate etc To those people he is a saint. That’s what they think of him.
Hugh Jarse said | May 31st 2009 @ 9:30pm | Report comment
Robbos – the media have made him this? are you completely deranged?
He opens his mouth. He talks nonsense. He gives himself a bad name. He hangs around with people that give him a bad name.
And one so-called sports journalist from the SMH-Channel 9 makes out that his every move is the work of a noble statesman.
Give me a break!!!
Christchurch said | May 31st 2009 @ 11:12pm | Report comment
Mundine does a lot of good. Indigenous Australians have been punished for their protests and tend to ‘look after’ us europeans. Looking after us, means putting up with decades of abysmal behaviour, when to protest, object or act against would lead to official sanction or legal punishment.
I especially enjoyed watching the Green Mundine bout at my local RSL. About half the audience wanted to see Mundine brought down. They finished subdued, brooding over their beers.
Wally, Pat Rafter, John Eales et al are fantastic role models and so is Mundine. We all have a different history, and need different role models. An exceptional sportsman, devout Muslim and proud Aborigine.
Gerry Faehrmann said | June 1st 2009 @ 8:33am | Report comment
I’m sorry I said anything!
Savvas Tzionis said | June 1st 2009 @ 8:43am | Report comment
Mundine is great …. the fact that he upsets so many Conservative’s is hilarious.
sheek said | June 1st 2009 @ 9:08am | Report comment
I have done a 180 degree turn on Mundine. Like many others, I couldn’t stand the sight of the guy. But I’ve learnt a few things about him over the years.
Firstly, the obvious. He has done more for Australian boxing these past 6 or so years than anyone else.
Secondly, he has reached the highest level as an athlete in two sports. Not many can do this. Michael Jordan couldn’t. He won a rugby league premiership with Brisbane in 1997 (super league) & a world championship crown in boxing.
Thirdly, & here’s the clincher. He is very generous with both his money & time, & has given a great deal to charities, helping fellow Aborigines & the homeless & downtrodden.
This last point is rarely mentioned in the media, because they would much prefer we continue to hate Mundine, because it helps to sell more newspapers.
Fourthly, Mundine has tremendous personal mental strength. People can think what they like about him, but he has remained true to himself, his family, his friends, his people, his religion & his ideals. No easy feat considering the abuse he has had to put up with.
How many of us so quick to put the boot in, can claim to have many of his truly admirable qualities???
Robbos said | June 1st 2009 @ 9:50am | Report comment
Hugh Jarse, yes he trash talks, his brash big mouth doesn’t endear him to many ‘White’ Australians. But please tell me what makes him the most disliked sportsman in Australia, when we have sportsaman like Bird, Gallen, Cousins, Carey, Warney, let’s not just pick on Johns (the Cronulla players), Mason (the Bulldogs players involved in Coffs Harbour) if not created by the media.
Abit like how Sonny Bill Williams was also the most dispised sportsman last year, yes he did the wrong thing by walking out on his contract, but as he said he was treated like a mass murderer, it’s not as if he glassed his girlfriend or something. But then maybe he was also associated to Mundine.
Bill said | June 1st 2009 @ 9:58am | Report comment
To be the best you have to beat the best. Mundine has fought outside Australia only twice. His win in Canada against journey man figher Kevin Pompey in 2001 was followed up by a knock out loss to Ottke in Germany a few months later. When Mundine did fight a true champion in Mikkal Kessler he was beaten badly on points.
Until Mundine beat a true world champion (no disrespect intended of Daniel Geale) I will reserve my judgement of his boxing ability.
Mark said | June 1st 2009 @ 10:36am | Report comment
Sheek – also consider when Tzyu fought in Melb it was a to give him a shot at his first title & it was to a 1/2 empty stadium, yes the promotion was rubbish (I had to search hard to find one ad), but if Mundine came down here we’d sure know he was in town & I’m pretty sure he’d get a sellout crowd even if 1/2 of them only wanted to see him shut up.
Ali was the same, early in his career he learnt from watching a pro wrestler self promote a bout & get a sell out crowd to a ’show’ when the cometing title bout had plenty of empty seats. He then decided to grow his self advertising ability.
Bill – perfectly put, he’s done well but he’s no Tzyu (yet).
sheek said | June 1st 2009 @ 11:18am | Report comment
Hugh Jarse,
Love your moniker, especially when you say it quickly!
onside said | June 1st 2009 @ 11:24am | Report comment
sheek
nice balance.
LeftArmSpinner said | June 1st 2009 @ 11:44am | Report comment
As said in Sundays press, if he behaved better and was less confrontational, he would be earning three times what he is currently, $2m p.a. Just look at that british boxer of the 90’s Prince Naseem Hamed. A real show off but he could really back it up. But he used to deride his opponents, until Barrera beat him. Prince didnt seek a rematch!
Robert B said | June 1st 2009 @ 12:06pm | Report comment
Manny Pacquiao should fight Mundine.
sheek said | June 1st 2009 @ 12:56pm | Report comment
Leftie,
Mundine was humble & generous to Geale after their fight, firstly embracing him in the ring with a “very well done”, & visiting his dressing room afterwards to offer more condolences & encouragement.
For all of Mundine’s showmanship faults, the two gestures mentioned above indicate C-L-A-S-S.
Chop said | June 1st 2009 @ 1:04pm | Report comment
I don’t know Mundine, I respect the bloke for what he does in his community and what he’s achieved as a sportsman, but his carry-on just makes me want to cheer for who ever he’s against.
I can still remember the fact that he played the race card after being beaten out of the NSW state of origin team by two players named Daley and Fittler. As a footballer he was ok, but he was not up to that standard and wasn’t picked because he was not up to that standard regardless of race.
sheek said | June 1st 2009 @ 7:08pm | Report comment
Mundine’s problems as a footballer explain why he took up an individual sport like boxing.
As a rugby league player, Mundine was exceptionally gifted, with terrific skills, good vision, anticipation & a box of tricks, but he far too often ran away from his supports, or failed to use them effectively.
Rugby league being a team sport, Mundine struggled to fit into the team game. Maybe as a junior, he was able to win matches on his own. But when he got to the senior ranks, he still struggled to use his supports effectively.
All great players must still be able to have a style of game that allows teammates to be part of the picture/plan. I agree with Chop that he failed to win NSW SOO selection probably because of this, & certainly not because of race.
damos_x said | June 1st 2009 @ 7:49pm | Report comment
you sure are a disgusted man Wally, especially when the topic relates to aboriginal men so i’ll clarify for you since you clearly didn’t understand the context of the comment in my post. Mundine is a better role model for young aboriginal men than the many poor influences they currently have. i’d be prepared to accept your outright dislike without criticism as your right to have & express an opinion except that you seem to believe that the same right shouldn’t apply to those you dislike. as for the top class athlete bit, what exactly is your stringent criteria ? boxing has it’s fair share of alphabet titles but go tell a boxer that his isn’t worth all the effort put in, so at this point Mundine is a multiple world title holder in two weight classes & also a former NSW State of Origin rep which in itself would be quite admirable. align this with his award as Aboriginal & Torres Strait Islander of the year in 2000 & numerous Deadly Award wins in sporting categories adds up to a fairly decent bloke as well as athlete. perhaps the problem here is that you don’t rate boxing as a sport & would prefer to have aboriginal men who were seen but not heard ? i won’t go any further down that path Wally but your comments about his lack of class when representing his country betrays the fact that you seem to think that you are the country rather than the multitude of different people & attitudes that exist in our great land. i’m still not sure that you aren’t just a shit stirrer because thus far your argument on Mundine’s character & athletic ability is based on your dislike of his personal style & the fact that he is not someone else, John Eales for example, & that means he is a poor example to children & a poor representative of his country.
Hugh Jarse said | June 1st 2009 @ 8:53pm | Report comment
OK people, I’ll have one more post and then leave it alone.
In my opinion, Mundine is
* an exceptionally gifted athlete. I’m sure he could have succeeded in any number of other sports.
* someone who has achieved great successes, as much through hard work as through natural talent.
* extremely generous with his time and resources when it comes to those less fortunate than himself.
* a great role model for young aboriginal boys/men.
* a fairly ordinary attempt to be a showman. Frankly, I don’t think he has the personality to pull it off. He should leave it to those that have.
* i have no basis for saying this, but I think he is probably poorly advised, in terms of PR, by those around him.
That’s about as balanced as I can be, but I will always support a humble gentleman such as Daniel Geale against a brash, vain loud-mouth like Anthony Mundine any day of the week.
Robbos said | June 1st 2009 @ 9:50pm | Report comment
What comes out of Mundine’s mouth also makes me cringe & I’m a fan of his ability, but, what I’m harping about is there are Australian sportsman that are morally least deserving of our adulation, but you don’t hear the media go on about them. Yet they go headstrong against a brash, lippy, confident, controversial, but morally correct young man (non drinker, no drug taker, respectful to women).
Mark said | June 2nd 2009 @ 9:02am | Report comment
Robbos – but you expect more support for a mouthy koori muslim than for a bogan ?? C’mon you’re talking about a country that’s only just come to realise it needed to say Sorry.
I’m from NZ whch is about 20 yrs ahead of Australia in recognising what was done even 50 yrs ago was wrong & asttempting to resolve the subsequent issues (higher unemployment/convictions/mortality/ etc) & my parents generation still struggle with the concept of maori politicians & political parties. You’re seriously expecting Australia to be ready for mundine ? look at what Ali had to do to be accepted – retire !
Sportsmouth said | June 4th 2009 @ 2:30pm | Report comment
Doesn’t drink.
Doesn’t smoke.
Doesn’t do drugs.
Gave up a highly paid job (rugby league) to fulfil his dream job (how many of us can say that?!)
Steps into the square circle to face his opponents and half the country who want to see him knocked out, but continues to raise the profile of his sport.
Has given back more to the community then all of us here judging him. I’d say very few of us have the right to judge him unless you’ve done at least half of what he did, regardless of success or failure!
Art Sapphire said | June 4th 2009 @ 2:35pm | Report comment
Sportsmouth is the man on this thread – good post
retiredrucker said | June 4th 2009 @ 3:42pm | Report comment
Very enlightening, I’m glad he has a “real side” and achieved so much for his community.
He lost me as asupporter with his post 911 comments, even if it was just about raising his profile.
I hope he understands the privilege it is to be able to speak your mind with out fear in a democracy, something only about 20% of the world population can do.
Pippinu said | June 4th 2009 @ 4:02pm | Report comment
If Mundine had been in the US when he made those comments, I daresay they would have shipped him off to Guantanamo Bay as quickly as you can say “luv yers all” (when his greatest crime would have been failing to express himself properly).
Doesn’t India alone have about 20% of the World’s population?
Art Sapphire said | June 4th 2009 @ 4:23pm | Report comment
You think Mundine has it tough – Ali was vilified in the U.S – he converted to Islam and he could not fight for 3 years because he refused to serve in Vietnam or as he so eloquently put it
“I ain’t got no quarrel with them Viet Cong … They never called me nigger.”
Now everything is forgiven and he is treated like a national icon.
Then again, I would hate to think what would have happened to him in Bush’s America
NORMAN said | June 7th 2009 @ 9:47pm | Report comment
Anthony has often complained that we , the general publc are racist. I recall another loud -mouth, Rocky Gatellari.
The entire Australian public cheered as Lionel Rose shut the mouth quite savagely, no racial prejudice. just a fair
dinkum guy doing his job. Rocky then had the audacity to make a comeback and took a dive (and the money).
SO MUCH FOR BIG MOUTHS.
keith said | July 13th 2009 @ 7:20pm | Report comment
mundine needs to sit down and actually have alook at himself , when he first started boxing , i backed him to the hilt , having to cop plenty off the others watching his fights at the pub, but i have to admitt i have gone right off him , he appears to promote racism , sure there are many racist people , no matter what breed , but myself and many others i know were brought up around aboriginal people , and we are not racist ,we stayed at their place the same as they stayed at ours , As for the geale fight , well sure , it could have gone either way, but the fact that Daniel was the champion , and fought like a champion , he should have retained the title , there was no dirty tactics from him ,. Agreeing with the other comment , have a listen to all mundine fights in australia , the same commentator speaks him up like he is legend status. It really is a shame , because like him or dislike him , he is a pretty good fighter.