By Steve Kaless
October 22nd 2008 @ 3:05am
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That World Cup is half full!
Oh dear, poor little rugby league really upset the apple cart by deciding to revive its own World Cup. Like most rugby league fans, I’m looking forward to the event. It makes it much easier to fill in the weekend when you know there’s more action on the field to balance the blow-by-blow account of the Broncos off season.
And what better way to spend the next weekend than entrenched in a festival of rugby league.
Now, you show me a rugby league fan that doesn’t feel warm all over with the mere mention of the word “Kumuls” and I’ll show you a fraud.
Plenty of league fans had their turn cheering on their ’second teams’ this season with the Raiders and then the Warriors getting a turn, as blokes rummaged through their wardrobe for anything green before heading to pub or rattled off lines from Once Were Warriors to try and worm their way into the team’s supporter base.
But that was all a dress rehearsal, because the Kumuls are back in town and Papua New Guinea are officially everyone’s, and I mean everyone’s, second team.
If England normally fulfill the role of pantomime villain, then they better get ready for the crowd at their opening at match to all be bellowing “He’s behind you!,” because there will be few locals putting their support on the St George’s cross.
There would be more romance in a Kumuls opening match victory than the entire collected works of Barbara Cartland. Or, indeed, the back catalogue of PNG coach Adrian Lam’s efforts in the adult entertainment industry.
But the mood before this tournament is far from any blue light disco.
It may not be carnival in Rio, but it’s certainly enough to raise the spirits.
What has stunned me is the reaction of so many union and football fans about rugby league having the brazen temerity to host a World Cup.
Now, I don’t think there would be a single league fan who would argue that this World Cup is bigger than the football or union equivalent (in the same way that no union fan would argue that theirs holds a flame to football’s).
But does that mean we aren’t allowed to hold one?
It seems that the kill-joys seem to feel that by league looking to find a place on the international stage, it is chipping away at their deemed order of things.
The union fans who seem most upset about the league World Cup are the ones who use union’s international superiority as a security blanket when they see league towering over them in the heartlands of NSW and Queensland.
Don’t worry fellas, we’ll keep the music down after eleven and make sure there aren’t any bottle tops left lying around afterwards.
You can even come along if you want.
But you have to promise to enjoy the game for what it is and not continue to make snide remarks about a game only played in New South Wales, Queensland and Wigan.
This World Cup is all about consolidation.
The organisers are honest enough to know that putting some sides up against Australia is only going to result in triple figure deficits, which never look good (like a certain other World Cup I could mention).
But the tournament has been structured so as to be financially viable and also offer a chance for the game to grow in targeted areas.
Garth Hamilton yesterday offered two examples in an attempt to ridicule league’s efforts: Lebanon and France.
It is true that in the previous incarnation of the Cedars at the last World Cup was made up of players who plied their trade in Australia. Although, it’s not like they wouldn’t be classed as Lebanese.
Hazem El Masri was born in Tripoli, so surely he would tick the right boxes.
But after that tournament, the International Rugby League Federation instructed the team’s management that in order for them to participate at the next tournament, they would need to set up a competition in Lebanon.
They did just that. And the game is now played throughout university’s in the country.
A number of players from that competition also took part in the qualification for this World Cup, which saw them miss out at the last hurdle after being beaten by Samoa, a country whose rugby league community is also looking to re-establish itself.
Since then the Lebanese side have played a Tri-Nations tournament against Russia and Serbia.
The French were also dismissed for only fielding one side “worthy of first class competition.”
That one side is certainly a vast improvement from a few years back and also neglects to acknowledge Toulouse’s attempt to gain entry into the Super League and their participation in England’s National League One competition.
But like the maidens that Mr Hamilton referred to, some people will simply never be happy with what is on offer.
As Catalan Dragons talisman Thomas Bosc may say, “cest la vie.”
We might be on the road to nationalising all the banks, but we don’t yet have the secret police listening through the keyhole (although to be fair we do have Oztam and Viacom). So if you don’t want to watch, the simple solution is not to.
However, the prospect of seeing Tonga and Samoa battling it out at the foot of the mountains certainly gets my pulse racing. The Pacific Islander is pretty much the prototype for both rugby codes, so seeing Tonga and Samoa is akin to watching the two versions of the Terminator battle it out in T2.
The same can be said for the Aboriginal side selected to play ahead of the Australia versus New Zealand match.
It’s a tremendous idea, probably ten years overdue, but something which properly acknowledges the contribution of indigenous Australians to the game of rugby league.
So my advice is that if you want to talk about a decline, look at the sharemarket or the prospects of the value of your home.
But if it’s a bit more rugby league that you’re after, then get yourself a second, third and fourth team, fire up the barbie, and enjoy your footy.
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The Link said | October 22nd 2008 @ 8:09am | Report comment
Steve - simple answer is of course League can have its own World Cup.
No WC gets within cooee of Football.
The Tonga Samoa clash will be huge. I hear the local KFC is stocking up on buckets of chicken to meet the demand.
‘The union fans who seem most upset about the league World Cup are the ones who use union’s international superiority as a security blanket when they see league towering over them in the heartlands of NSW and Queensland.’
Not a truer word spoken
Luke W said | October 22nd 2008 @ 8:58am | Report comment
I have to disagree with you Steve; I think the glass is half empty. The RLWC is simply an attempt from the IRLF/NRL to make a quick buck. I am not completely sure what the powers that be hope to achieve from the RLWC, but I would assume the growth of the game on a global stage is the main goal. But this goal is massively compromised by the IRLF lax citizenship standards. While I was never completely supporting the RLWC, my decision to boycott it came about when I read that Rooster/Shark Anthony Tupou would not be playing for Tonga because he was selected for Australia. What?!? If you have a Samoan citizenship you play for Samoa! I think casual fans of sport will ignore the RLWC because it is difficult to believe that players like Jarryd Hayne are passionate about playing for Fiji when you know they would trade in their jersey and citizenship to get a run for Australia or New Zealand. The other reason is that a World Cup should be the pinnacle of a sport, and this will not be the case for the RLWC. I don’t think the RLWC will compare to the 2008 Finals Series we just witnessed, let alone SoO. I just don’t think international rugby league is ready to hold a World Cup.
Mr Mac said | October 22nd 2008 @ 9:37am | Report comment
Steve
You may be correct in the PNG is everyones favourite team but have you ever seen a draw that gave a team absolutely no chance.
The have been put in the group with all the heavies. It was designed to get the three “name teams” Oz, NZ & GB into the semis and also avoid the “cricket scores” when the big boys belt the little kids. It creates an illusion of even standards however the 4th team in the “premier” pool is the sacrifice.
Had they been in any other group they had some chance of another game after the pools were over.
How many RL followers are aware of this coming at a time when PNG wants a team in the NRL
Is this an example of a fair go? - I doubt it!
oikee said | October 22nd 2008 @ 9:41am | Report comment
Funny if you look at where league is growing in france, right down the bottom of the country near the spain border, now from what i can see is a simalar senerio to what afl and league have here in australia, the growth of league will remain in this part of france and hopefully cross the border into spain. Lebanon is well placed to grow the game around that area. What is really amusing is the fact that league never gets many favours, oz has always been a stronghold, england it was practically dead and buried but has risen like a colossus to be reformed and expanding more than it ever could in the past. The one question that really has to be asked is why do people continually try to put the game down, is the game really a threat to other sports. The way they act you would think so.
I see garth has gone back to his own blog site, with very few reply’s. Must be the male version of rebecca wilson.?
oikee said | October 22nd 2008 @ 9:52am | Report comment
PNG are a very proud nation, they have embraced the fact that they are rated in the heavy weights pool, not to mention the experience that this will give the team, if you are going to play with the big boys you have to play with the big boys, no good giving other teams a flogging and then hit the main group to get the same flogging yourself. Let them evolve i say, they have played australia before, they know what to expect. For this reason we will all be cheering for them.
Mr Mac said | October 22nd 2008 @ 9:59am | Report comment
Oikee
Do you give one of your best kids three beltings and send them to bed while the others get to play and stay up late just so they will grow up tough?
Luv your logic!
Michael C said | October 22nd 2008 @ 10:02am | Report comment
oikee -
that Catalan region seems very interesting indeed.
Since you’ve mentioned AFL - - I’ll let you know also that AFL footy in Spain and France has been getting established in recent years - - and the Catalan region especially (Barcelona, Valls , Lleida and Tarragona).
And the reality down there is that ex-pats seem to have had stuff all to do with it. I remember seeing the Spanish team at the 2005 IC in Melb and didn’t hear a single word of English or see one person involved who didn’t appear ‘Spanish’ (so to speak) - - although they were predominantly from Madrid and there is an impass that stops a combined Madrid/Catalan team from representing the ‘political entity’ of Spain.
So, if RugbyL is going down there too - - it makes them sound like interesting people seeking something a little bit ‘different’ to be involved in.
Interesting.
oikee said | October 22nd 2008 @ 10:27am | Report comment
M.C you will find that AFL has better access to expand than league anywhere, theres no objections from other codes, league always has to deal with union before it has even started, the fans are against the game, so as you can now see is the reason by leagues slow expansion. AFL will do quite well, and so it should, if it had expanded 30-50 years ago it would be a world game by now.
Mrs mac, i really dont know what you are saying, all i know is i got beltings as a kid, did me the world of good, shame we have lost that now but i am not getting into politics, PNG have been around a long time, they have regular matches each year with oz, and they have players who know the ropes well, they have played oz while the mighty Mal was playing, they are not a push-over by any means. Let them evolve is what i say, and i stand by this because they know what to expect, which is how far they have come. They even have there own origin games played there, so more advanced than most countries.
oikee said | October 22nd 2008 @ 10:35am | Report comment
Just for your info mrs mac, i was the oldest of 3 boys and the number 1 son, dads blue eyed blond haired boy so to speak, i can also say that i have prospered the best of the 3 because as you know i would be the one in the firing line, how you can translate that to league is anyone’s quess but you brought it up, not me.
Mr Mac said | October 22nd 2008 @ 10:50am | Report comment
Oikee
Disparaging comments never justify an opinion. At our age we all got beltings - justified or otherwise - benificial maybe but I bet our parents did not discriminate or pick on just one sibling.
However, the point of my argument is that it is not fair that PNG is sacrificed to give the RLWC an appearance of “evenness” by not giving one country an fair go.
That PNG has been around for a long time, that its national sport is RL and that it has an inter province competition are not justifications for an inbalanced competition.
I am sure that if the soceroos were placed in a 4 taem WC pool with FIFA rankings 1, 2, & 3 and told that the top 3 teams advanced while the other pools had a different structure we would be bellowing like castrated bulls
Michael C said | October 22nd 2008 @ 11:15am | Report comment
oikee -
it’s the thing about RugbyU and RugbyL that I’m becoming more and more aware of - - in many places there’s this ‘ancient’ enmity, and for differing reasons - - the whole WWII French thing is amazing.
The thing about AFL - many folk rabbit on about if after 150 years we can’t ‘conquer’ all of Australia, what hope growing internationally - - - well, we know that the ‘anti’ sentiment in parts of Australia is hugely strong and THAT sentiment won’t necessarly be met internationally (or perhaps local versions of similar sentiment for whatever reasons!!!). [however, venues for full 18 a side will always be an issue]
oikee said | October 22nd 2008 @ 11:16am | Report comment
Understand your point mrs mac, well taken and you have got to realise that one win by png could get them through, as for the soccer world cup i would love to see the socceroos playing the big 3, even if they got belted, unfortunately that day may never come. As for PNG there time is now, grab it by both hands.
Or forever hold your peace. I dont know for sure but someone famous said that i think.?
oikee said | October 22nd 2008 @ 11:28am | Report comment
Not really a issue, if you expand with cricket in mind then it would be sensible, and like you i 1st thoguht that afl had no chance of world expansion, now i have seen how cricket can help its expansion, same applies for union , league, but having said this you know what league is up against, the other opposition to league has come from the U.K itself, it has been down trodding in that part of the world for many more years, they still dont want the game to be a success but have now had to accept league and the government has changed its outlook on the game.
Never plain sailing for league M.C but i really love the battle its been through over the years, part of its history is the battle, makes for good reading. Unfortunately for you M.C you wont have such a battle, only oz which really is just a war of words, your game has expanded quite well even in leagues backyard. I seen the english league team training at carrera on the coast, they were saying how good the ground was, grass that is and facilities.
Hoy said | October 22nd 2008 @ 11:47am | Report comment
I remember seeing the big three in the one pool and thinking that was poor planning as one was going to have to miss out as the normal process is the top two go through.
Just checked the website and saw how it works. Not a great set up really I don’t think.
Not fair to anyone who ends up in the big boys league there.
Does anyone know how they set it up? Was it all drawn out of a hat, or seeded?
oikee said | October 22nd 2008 @ 11:48am | Report comment
M.C this is completely off track of this post but i just wanted to ask you a question, its got nothing to do with sport and is not a trick question, just like to know your opinion , If you needed to use a barrister for a matter that you might ever have would you shop around for one, and if you found a barrister charging lets say 5000 a day and you found one only charging 2500 a day , what would you do? This might help you also, nothing to do with sport . Any opinion.
oikee said | October 22nd 2008 @ 11:57am | Report comment
Its a new concept Hoy, it has been thought up by the RLIF to make the games more exciting for veiwers, who knows some of the other world cup codes might adapt this to their games in the future. Its fair on all teams except maybe PNG but we dont really know yet what PNG might take out of this comp, they are seeded 5th i think and are rated highly by the governing body, in soccer this is all important to countries being seeded high, i read a report the other day that mentioned the socceroos seeding and they were wingeing about being seeded so low, they would have had a choice of france or png but they picked png above france. What you have to remember is that they want the best teams playing the finals, if png make it through then they are one of the best teams.
sheek said | October 22nd 2008 @ 11:59am | Report comment
Oikee,
Love your passionate support for rugby league, if not always your logic & facts.
Michael C said | October 22nd 2008 @ 12:01pm | Report comment
Oikee - re first one - - yep, it’s all a matter of perspective.
One thing, in India. there’s cricket ovals, but, cricket has them for around 7 odd months a year, in some places, soccer then pops in for 3 months - - doesn’t leave much room…….the irony might be that if soccer can take off enough to build it’s own venues, then the door could open wider for AFL in India!!!! (and likewise, if soccer build rectangle venues, then Rugby could benefit directly there too).
2nd one -
first I’d seek to avoid the need ofr a barrister in the first place. I’d certainly shop around for one, it’d be nice to NOT have to be price sensitive and be guided instead by ‘personality’ aspects, reputation etc. I like to think that like wine, price is less the arbiter of quality and more the indication of marketing…..in most things, I think the joy and even challenge is to seek out the bargains off the path most commonly trodden.
oikee said | October 22nd 2008 @ 12:19pm | Report comment
Thanks sheek, and sometimes i bend those facts to the limit, but who doesn’t.
M.C keeps most facts in order anyhow, if we get to far out of line i have noticed he puts us right. No harm trying.
Wine, funny subject, if you enjoy it and it only cost you 5 dollars then good. If you want to impress then dont pull the 5 dollar bottle out , do pull it out is you have the rellos coming over. Funny world.
Will give you some good advice now M.C and yes hopefully you will never have to use a barrister, but you might know someone close who may, and your reputation paragraph was good, but here is some sound advice for you, and you can take this with you, always pay for the highest priced barrister, not only are you getting better advice with a barrister who has been in and out of courts all his life but you are also saving money.
A barrister who is going to charge you that amount will be set-up in the big courts in the city so he also would have access to even better advice being a Q.C (queens council) or judges. So with this knowleadge he will also save you money and make you money,
saving as in he wont drag the case on for as long, so if it took him half a day to finish a case you would only pay him 2500, with the other barriister he would take 2 days costing you 5000,
and to top it off the other barrister, not really being that clever, would get you lets say 100,000 return where as the good barrister would get you 300,000 return. You can take that with you if you ever need to have to make that decision. Cheers.
Mr Mac said | October 22nd 2008 @ 12:25pm | Report comment
Oikee
Your’e not Malcolm Turnbull in disguise - are you?
Ah! - No! ’cause he’d know that QC’s are now SC’s
oikee said | October 22nd 2008 @ 2:33pm | Report comment
Hehe, No not malcolm, just talking from experience learned. If you go through life being draged through the gutter you come out the other side smelling of roses. Someone famous said that?
I see there is 4 games on this week-end, monday. Somehow i am thinking the melbourne clash is going to be the highlight of the series. My wife told me she does not care as long as she gets to see england play. Fingers crossed there.
Considering she only watches the bull-riding i think its quite a acheivement that so far she has been to a union world cup game and origin game along with a broncos cowboys clash and now 2 league world cup games. In england she never knew what sport was.
Looking forward to a Aussie rules game in melbourne, she might want to stay there. ?
Ben C said | October 22nd 2008 @ 3:13pm | Report comment
Oikee
Your analysis of barristers is wonderfully superficial. Choosing a barrister is a matter of ‘horses for courses’ and the more expensive barrister is not always the best choice.
Approaching barristers, and the law generally, as something that will make you money is naive. Going to the law will cost you money, the question is whether the cost is worth it.
oikee said | October 22nd 2008 @ 3:31pm | Report comment
Wont get to far into the subject Ben.C was only giving a bit of advice on a different subject. Most people at some stage will need a barrister, weather they like it or not. Thats only the tip of the ice-burg i have given, you can either take the advice or not. I am not selling anything. And you might look naive to me if you are willing to waste money, we all know it makes the world go round.
Just on that Barrister subject. A good barrister will also save you money before you even get to court. If he advises you to go to court he is there to win, Winners and Losers in every game.
So you now have a good barrister, unlikely he will lose because the other barrister will lose. Why do i say this, the good barrister already knows he is going to win so there barrister is a amatuer, if he was any good the problem would have been solved before it got to court.
The good barrister would never hardly come up against another good barrister because the other good barrister has already given good advice to his clients.
If the other barrister is stupid enough to get to mediation then the mediator tells him he is a bad barrister and the problem gets solved before court. Just helping you understand the system. Like i said could take more but its just the tip of the iceburg.
Theres a world cup on shortly, looking forward to humidity reports from townsville.
True Tah said | October 22nd 2008 @ 3:39pm | Report comment
oikee,
generally speaking, unless you are a solicitor, you have little say in who your barrister is going to be in court.
Mr Mac said | October 22nd 2008 @ 3:42pm | Report comment
Oikee
Stick to RL
oikee said | October 22nd 2008 @ 3:49pm | Report comment
Only Poeple who dont know any better think that true tah, and thats a sad fact of the system, also a good lesson for you and glad you brought it up, always make sure you know who you are getting and do some reseach, its not hard, they have a list of barristers online and there rankings. So another point, make sure you get the right barrister for the right job. Its like sport ,
sorry mrs mac. Will not talk on the subject any further, but now i am sure you have learnt something.
David Gilbank said | October 22nd 2008 @ 4:16pm | Report comment
Goddamn it Steve, that’s a brilliant read. As always, your belief that the codes should “live in let live” sets a great example for all of us. See you in Brissie!
JimC said | October 22nd 2008 @ 4:18pm | Report comment
Luke: “The other reason is that a World Cup should be the pinnacle of a sport, and this will not be the case for the RLWC. I don’t think the RLWC will compare to the 2008 Finals Series we just witnessed, let alone SoO.”
Well, I disagree, but anyway, this rule isn’t applied in other sports.
The world cup in soccer isn’t the pinnacle, the Champions league is. No way either of the finalists in 2006 would beat most Champions league sides.
maybe in rugby union it’s the pinnacle but for how long?
Millster said | October 22nd 2008 @ 4:52pm | Report comment
How boring that the same arguments are given a new thread to repeat themselves on.
Although humorous that there is talk of a barrister in this thread. The RLIF certainly has a case to answer of false and misleading conduct in relation to calling their cute little charade of a tournament a World Cup.
oikee said | October 22nd 2008 @ 6:34pm | Report comment
brad said | October 22nd 2008 @ 8:45pm | Report comment
The game is definately a threat to rugby Union here are the reasons. Footbal and league are both simple games and hence appeal to the masses with the growth of the world economy these masses that previously had to work on saturdays now have more free time and while football is a religion league can offer an alternative sideshow. Rugby union is way to complex and only appeals to those of higher intellect. It is the same for the classy restaurant on the corner that has to deal with a new mcdonalds openning accross the street while he is able to maintain his current patronage he can not expand and in a while the Mcdonalds will be richer bigger and start stealing his patrons. its sad that the world is full of average intellect people.
Mr Mac said | October 22nd 2008 @ 8:53pm | Report comment
Brad
Are trying to ignite class warfare?
Westy said | October 22nd 2008 @ 9:03pm | Report comment
I tell you what some of you are hard task masters. The league World Cup is no where neaf Football’ who is ? which far exceeds Rugby which is far l in front of Leagues.
One should be accurate. First the RL World Cup is run by ARL not the NRL. The ARL is responsible for the international league and its development. It has always been handicapped by a lack of funds . The 20million cash that nine has paid it for the free to air rights only for the World Cup and the futher 10 million or more from Pay TV here and overseasincluding Britain/ Europe with including that hotbed of league in Serbia paytv and Russian pay tv even sold it in South east asia and of course Japan is actually one of the best things these morons have done in years.
The ARL refused the NRL’s request to sell the rights as a package in their previous rights deal to nine a few years a go They have actually shown real business acumen. They have put together a cool 30 million. and will net at least 10 million. This fund will be used exclusively for the development of league overseas. Whether it is a small affair or not it gives them the funding to develop their game.You do not have to like it but they have domne well.
Every Australian rugby supporter on this site should hold our heads in shame for we squandered our over 40 million nest egg from our World Cup without much further improvement in the state of our game except perhaps at subbies level.If league actually spend their 10 million on developing their game then their “World Cup ” will be an outstanding success.
Westy said | October 22nd 2008 @ 9:12pm | Report comment
. The ARL has been paid over 30million in free to air and pay tv rights. Not bad for a joke ? How much is rugby getting for the test in Hong Kong.?I think I will go to Tonga v Samoa game at Penrith. So will a fair few” rugby “people in the West.
Alan Nicolea said | October 22nd 2008 @ 9:32pm | Report comment
Millister
Are the Americans entitled then to call their baseball series a ‘world series’ then? If you think international league is a joke, you have not seen american team sports mate. NFL is played most of the time in America while baseball is american ruled. Basketball really is the only sport in which america dominates, but atleast has some challengers, among them Spain, Argentina, Croatia, Lithuania, Australia to an extent and China.
League is more of a world cup than american baseball is a world series. Nevertheless, the tournament that kicks off on Sunday is a WORLD CUP. End of story. The only reason we hear so much about American team sports is because their population is huge and they run the bloody world……… until now.
Steve Kaless said | October 23rd 2008 @ 1:17am | Report comment
Millster,
“The RLIF certainly has a case to answer of false and misleading conduct in relation to calling their cute little charade of a tournament a World Cup.”
Congratulations. To borrow a line from the Simpsons, you may have indeed stumbled upon the greatest case of false advertising since the movie “The Never Ending Story.”
I can only imagine the shock that will hit so many punters when they turn up at say Tonga v Samoa and realise that the competition does not have every single country in the world involved in pools of 68 countries each. The shame.
Like you, I believe a class action is necessary, but let’s make this one count, I say we should include in it all non member countries of FIFA and the IRB, and Tasmania, the Northern Territory and the ACT who have so far been excluded from the so called A- League.
It is time to make a stand.
The Link said | October 23rd 2008 @ 7:49am | Report comment
Millster,
“How boring that the same arguments are given a new thread to repeat themselves on.”
and then you go on to prove yourself correct in the next line.
The only repeated argument i’m reading on this topic is that sports are entitled to call their competitions what they want.
Ben C said | October 23rd 2008 @ 10:09am | Report comment
Oikee
I would not admit it in polite company but I have been a solicitor for 12+ years. Money is not always the best guide to quality when it comes to barristers, as I said it is horses for courses. Why brief a $5,000 a day QC in a $20,000 dispute in the Local Court?
As a died in the wool RU supporter I have no difficulty with Rugby League calling their tournament a world cup. It’s just a name. If they advertised it as bigger than the RWC that would be one thing but what is the problem with RL being aspirational and inclusive? I wouldn’t pay to watch a RL match but I can’t understand the mentality of some people who are offended about the mere existence of RL. The world would be boring if we all watched RU and, more importantly, if RU was the only game in town my TAHS subscription would be a lot more expensive.
Millster said | October 23rd 2008 @ 10:38am | Report comment
Alan - I agree 110% that the so-called “world series” in American domestic sports are a disgrace. Totally arrogant and pretensious. One of the very reasons to my objection to what League is doing is that I hate the fact it is falling into this pretense. It is a good game, yes. But it is NOT a world game.
Steve - ummm… I was trying to be witty and link the barrister side of things back to your man article while making a point. I think League suffers plenty enough without a class action from the stupidity of calling this tournament a World Cup and the comparisons this invites. Again not for a second suggesting that there shouldn’t be League internationals, but for gods sake lets find a better and more appropriate name for a 10 team tournament in which there is one ridiculously odds-on favourite, a couple of fringe European nations, and then some pacific atolls. Oh, and what was sarcasm the best refuge of again…?
Brad - I cannot believe you got away without screaming objection to your post. Hilarious!
Alan Nicolea said | October 23rd 2008 @ 10:44am | Report comment
Millister
How many nations then do you think atleast should participate in a tournament for it to be considered a world cup?
oikee said | October 23rd 2008 @ 11:02am | Report comment
Agree with you there Ben.C , the 2 sports are so simalar is the reason theres such a divide.
I had been useing a barrister not long ago in which the solicitor we were going through at the time had picked for us, he had told us that he had been at the bar for 10 years, ( having looked up his record after the fact he had only been there for 5) so after the mediation had all broken down and i had wasted thousands for poor advice i had to politely sack him. I told him when we are ready to go to court i will be finding a real barrister.
Thats how you sack them politely, your solicitor is not real happy because she has used this guy on many occassions, feel sorry for the people who has had the dill. So then what you do is find a barrister who you can trust and tell your solicitor that you are with him. If the solicitor dont like it you move to another one. As for the money side its already your money, your just fighting to retain it, nothing more.
Westy, very true and i know one thing they wont waste money on is Union players, they learnt a good leasson from Union scabbling all there money away on league players. All i see is that this world cup is a good starting point for the game to keep growing, its not massive like football world cup and never will be, i dont think we will ever feild a team from Qatar.
Just one little thing about aderlaide united win last nite, is it just me or does anyone else find it very hard to swallow a team losing a game and still being called the winners and the greatest moment in soccer history in this country. Is this sad, or am i just not really understanding that a loss can be called anything but a loss. And to put a loss at the greatest moment, is this the future, are we all going to be cheering loses.
oikee said | October 23rd 2008 @ 11:08am | Report comment
I looked at Brad’s reply sensably and it made sense to me, you only have to look at soccer to know it makes sense.
Millster i am going to call this world cup league “The Mass Gathering” just to make you happy, until next world cup where we might have russia and lebanon and maybe america if were lucky playing, then you cant object is some of the biggest countries are playing,
alright.
Millster said | October 23rd 2008 @ 11:11am | Report comment
Alan - I actually started an article a week ago with the hope that these things would be discussed, but people saw it as an attack on the RL WC rather than a general piece and so they didn’t try and build on the idea that we could come up with some criteria for a legit World Cup.
People always think I’m anti-League when I raise this but actually I prefer the game to Union and AFL (though I don’t mind those either) and I want it to do well. I hate the concept of a League World Cup because I think it damages League rather than does it good. This is what some people don’t get when they read my stuff. I just think the League world could be a lot cleverer and more appropriate in the way it promotes its international dimension.
On the ‘how many nations’ question, its not just a number. Its what qualification process has occurred, how many continents or regions are covered, basically whether there is a spread of teams that can really be called global. Also a spread of power - you could have nations from everywhere but if they are all minnows and only one region or country has all the power and is overwhelming favourite then its not really a meaningful world event. For example the cricket “World Cup” has entrants from all over but the power in the game is totally British Commonwealth / Empire, not worldwide.
Millster said | October 23rd 2008 @ 11:14am | Report comment
Oikster - anyway at least you know while I object to the name World Cup I’m legit in saying I’m not against the code as I’m going to the game at the SFS this weekend…
oikee said | October 23rd 2008 @ 11:21am | Report comment
Yes i know your off to the game (lucky basturd)
also have to let you know we have had some dummies running our game millster, why do you think our international game is weak, its improving now, slowly, i have told you why its slow to grow and i think you know, soccer has no simalar sport to compete with there game. Thats all i can say, you have to get your head around that.
Alan Nicolea said | October 23rd 2008 @ 11:27am | Report comment
Millister
In terms of Cricket’s commonwealth dominance…… i think that is about to change.
True Tah said | October 23rd 2008 @ 11:33am | Report comment
Millster
Britain once had a worldwide empire, and all of the major cricketing powers now were at one time a part of this.
I think you should have stopped at the game is totally British Commonwealth and left it at that.
oikee said | October 23rd 2008 @ 11:38am | Report comment
Imagine trying to promote baseball or even gridion to other countries, now that would be harder to acheive. I think the yanks are happy to just leave it alone, they probably look at what the other sports are and how fast they can grow and probably tell themselves why bother. The yanks are playing cricket now, i seen a article about the game. They would also have aussie rules in mind for the use of the grounds.
oikee said | October 23rd 2008 @ 11:40am | Report comment
I mentioned aussie rules, see if i can wake up M.C.
oikee said | October 23rd 2008 @ 11:44am | Report comment
I also read something about the brazillian rugby union team making it through their group for the world cup, Yes Brazil is where union and league would do well, not to mention great athelietes. Fast,(olimpics) strong and tough.
oikee said | October 23rd 2008 @ 12:03pm | Report comment
Has anyone seen the news coming out of townsville over the last couple of days, its incredible, you cant buy publicity like that, heres a rundown,
1;– Killer Croc on the loose, its growing bigger by the day, Started at 3 metres and is now 4 metres long.
2;– Wild dogs killl wallaby, (hehehe) residents fear child will be next.
3;– Blue whale found beached, scientists recover skelton for research.
4;–Record marlin caught at townsville weighing 490 kg’s
5;–Flamin idiots start bushfire burning down 8 houses.
6;– men in court over roadrage drama.
7;- Millatery out in force during manuvours poms arriveing soon.
Certainly has put townsville on the map, now there talk of the place becoming its own north queensland city. Struth. Bloody Nora. At least the poms who have travelled over are getting there moneys worth.
Millster said | October 23rd 2008 @ 1:19pm | Report comment
True Tah - hmm… not convinced. How many major British colonies were there in continental Europe (eastern and western)? Central Asia? South America? North-East Asia? Northern Africa? Yes I can point to a few, and yes the British Empire’s spread was impressive, but it was/is not a uniform global footprint and therefore at no time did its membership form a representative grouping of world nations. And even in areas of relative strength, fo example Africa and SE-Asia, they certainly had peer competition from other colonial powers such as Portugal, Holland and France meaning you could never argue the Commonwealth to be a representative subset of world nations…
Alan - genuinely curious as to who you see coming into the current cricket power-structure and disturbing it. I see a shift from the Aust-England axis to the subcontinent, but that is within the existing power base not an alternative to it.
True Tah said | October 23rd 2008 @ 2:06pm | Report comment
Millster,
I didn’t argue that the Commonwealth was a representative of subset nations - but it certainly spanned the globe like no other empire before or after, hence my statement it was worldwide, far more than the French (Indochina, Western and Northern Africa), Portugal (parts of southern Africa and India and Timor) and the Dutch (Suriname and Indonesia).
Michael C said | October 23rd 2008 @ 3:18pm | Report comment
For cricket - the 1 billion or so Indians just keep migrating, populating and providing a cricket base to ‘non-core’ countries…….Canada, US etc can suddenly become competitive largely on the back of such a ‘base’.
China has a govt department aimed at ‘other sports’, including cricket and a desire to become a world power - - after all, no point everyone playing just the one sport.
Oikee - you mentioned ‘Aussie Rules’……….remember, I’m an advocate of ‘Australian Football’………..(I was in town for a meeting this morning)
In FLorida, there’s a you beaut 3 or so oval facility which was made, originally hoping for ICC WC matches - but that didn’t happen. It’d be great for US footy nationals, but, alas, prices itself out of their market. This year, they used the air force base in Colorado, playing footy at ‘altitude’. (no, NOT in a plane!!!). (actually, the Canadians walked away with a lot of silverware)
oikee said | October 23rd 2008 @ 3:47pm | Report comment
I was outback for a meeting this arvo, mowing the lawn. I was reading the article about the international game being played at perth. The irish reckon you lot are a bunch of bullies M.C but are willing to give it to you this time.
I see the game on free to air at 11.45 so will tape it and probably watch it monday. Try to keep my week-ends free or the wife goes into a coma. She is getting all the Mass Gathering Games this week-end so dont want to push me luck.
Michael C said | October 23rd 2008 @ 4:04pm | Report comment
oikee -
the Irish, in their game don’t take too kindly to bumping, and tackling - - and don’t always adapt/prepare that well for the legal tackling etc in the IR games. The Irish though, in Gaelic have more leeway on the ankle tap perspective where as the Aussie players deem that as pretty dodgey - - - in most cases, it’s the clashing of too diverse cultures of acceptable on field violence!!!!
It’s funny, yesterday I heard on SEN Ross ALoisi talking about how often with the South Americans, they have to be educated that soccer in Australia isn’t played the way they do it (i.e. the Trinidad effort the other day) - - and ALoisi kept coming back to being concerned about what a nation brought up on NRL and AFL think of such efforts.
THe clash of sporting cultures……………….happens everywhere.
I think I’d rather deal with a weak kneed South American than a brawling Irishman…….
oikee said | October 23rd 2008 @ 4:35pm | Report comment
Love the way you put that piece M.C you won me once you mentioned Violence, not that i condone this, but its better to keep it on the field than off it. Yes also in rugby league we have it good here in oz, if we make a rule change then the other countries adapt to it, which is good for Aussie football because you get to teach the countries who are taking up the sport the best way to play the game. This is good because they play the game how it should be played. Being the country that finds all the flaws helps the other countries get off the ground quicker. Just a point i have realised..
True Tah said | October 23rd 2008 @ 5:13pm | Report comment
oikee,
in Argentina, a coach of a side threatened to kill his players if they lost the game - thats taking it a bit too seriously!
oikee said | October 23rd 2008 @ 5:34pm | Report comment
Agrre true tah, maybe he was on drugs, i seen a big guy the other day on t/v at a peewee game in the states who went after the ref because they lost. He king hit the ref and then got tackled by the other coach. Not a good look for the kids.
Westy said | October 23rd 2008 @ 6:34pm | Report comment
Some of us are far to judgemental or I suspect agenda driven. International League’s footprint is no where near Rugby let alone the true world game football.However I get concerned with either the intentional or accidental ignorance of the RLWC.
I did a search of World rugby league. A series of quite intensive playoffs have taken place over the last 9 months.place . There were the following World Zones; Europe A consisting of Ireland/Russia/Lebanon/Wales/ and Scotland the winner of which would qualify for the World Cup. and Europe B consisting of Georgia/Russia/Latvia/Estonia/Germany/Malta/Italy/Greece/Serbia/and Holland the top 2 of which went through to Europe playoffs. The decision to play extended playoffs was a developmental one to make sure developing nations had exposure to a series of games whether they made the Europe A group or not. The same rationale existed for the extended playoff competition in Europe A. eg Russia played over 10 games but did not qualify.
The losers of Europe A entered into a repercharge against the winners of the North Pacific Cup between USA and Japan to determine the another place in the World Cup.
The next zone was Pacific Cup between Samoa/Tonga/Cook Islands/ Fiji/ there was a fifth I think the top 3 of which would qualify.
Papua New Guinea/ Australia/ New Zealand and England were seeded as automatic qualifiers. What I feel uncomfortable about is their idea to play organised and extended playoffs amonst the lesser nations is an excellent development model . Russia and Lebanon moved on to a further better quality knockout. I note that the playoffs have resulted in the Czech Republic entering a permanent team in the annual Slavic Cup and will enter the playoffs for the next World Cup. The Czechs as part of their development will enter a team and host in 2009 the European Nations U/18s Cup an annual event including England/ Wales/ Ireland/Serbia/ rance and Russia.The playoffs have also seen a request from the Portuguese rugby national coach for a development tour and the prospects of playing a portuguese side especially given it is in the rugby off season.
RLWC only has a small relative international footprint . However it has one defining element that gives it some substance these smaller nations are putting their teams forward to play the best we have. They should be commended for having a go. More importantly I will refrain from ripping into a sport that is finally having a go at brodening its international appeal albeit from a very small base but a little wider than is often given credit.
True Tah said | October 23rd 2008 @ 6:44pm | Report comment
Well said Westy, agree with everything you said.
Matt S said | October 24th 2008 @ 9:35am | Report comment
The Royal Family of Tonga getting involved with the legal challenge to the RLIF. The Irish Times reporting on their team’s poor treatment on economy class travel. The Scotsman doing a feature on the Edinburgh Eagles player in the Scottish team, The Fijian President telling its team to watch the evils/temptations of Australian society.
This world cup may be small, but atleast there is growing interest with all participating nations from back home. If done right, the RLWC can only get bigger from here.
oikee said | October 24th 2008 @ 9:51am | Report comment
One thing that does not reslly worry me is competing with union, i really are not interested in ever being a bigger international sport than rugby union. Just as long as the games rugby league play internationally are good. And the way they have set up this group pools is fantastic and i hope they continue to use this set-up. Nobody enjoys a 50 point flogging but i do enjoy close matches between any country. Not to mention that these weaker teams can compete at mass gathering level. Come next mass gathering we could look at having teams who missed out playing in a simalar pool set-up. Its inavative and new.
Something that has come out of this Mass Gathering is the new found interest from the smaller nations. I read a article this morning about clive palmer putting his weight behind a new guinea team, and there persident is going all out to get stadium built by mining investors who will have interest in that country. Also i see the Tonga king is in Sydney ruffling feathers about MoiMoi and tunarki playing for Tonga, There court case is being paid by a sponser. Considering we are in a global downturn the game looks like its not taking any backwood steps.
oikee said | October 24th 2008 @ 10:00am | Report comment
Also seen a piece Andrew Johns wrote about the Fiji half-back, he said he is the best player he has ever seen, (dont tell french union
) so looking forward now to seeing Fiji in action. Getting goosebumps already.
Ian Noble said | October 24th 2008 @ 7:36pm | Report comment
Oikee
Is Eng v PNG sold out, my brother read in the Rugby League Express that the mayor of Townsville was urging Townsvillians to buy tickets?