Crusaders vs Reds: Super Rugby live scores

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    The Crusaders Vs. Queensland Reds

    2012 Super Rugby Tournament, 6 May, 2012

    Rugby Stadium, Addington, Christchurch
    The Crusaders 15 defeated Queensland Reds 11
    The Crusaders Queensland Reds
    15 FINAL SCORE 11
    0 TRIES 1
    5/6 PENALTY GOALS 2/3
    0/0 DROP GOAL 0/0
    Top scorers:
    • The Crusaders - Taylor
    • T 15pts (5G)
    Important moments:
    • Crusaders took the lead at the 75 min. mark 2nd half
    • Taylor, T (CRUS) penalty goal at the 79 min. mark 2nd half
    Referee: B Lawrence
    Touch judges: V Munro & K McBride

    They mightn’t admit it, but revenge will be firmly on the minds of the Crusaders when they host the Reds in the first rematch of the 2011 Super Rugby final in Christchurch this afternoon. We’ll have live scores from 2.00pm AEST.

    It has been the Crusaders of old in the past few weeks, with Todd Blackadder’s side racking up three consecutive victories after a sluggish start to 2012.

    While they still sit several wins behind the Chiefs, who lead the New Zealand Conference, they look to be building as the season goes on and even with a wildcard look a dangerous post-season prospect.

    Unfortunately the same cannot be said for today’s opponents, defending Super Rugby champions the Reds, who have looked a shadow of their 2011 selves.

    In a plus for Ewen McKenzie’s men, for one of the first occasions this season they come into this one without having been racked by further injury.

    They were definite signs of improvement when the Reds won 23-11 in Auckland last Friday night, and they will come into this one with increasing confidence.

    But against one of the form sides in the competition they’ll need to step it up another notch, and some of the stars of last season will need to find the form of last season’s final if they are to spring an upset of epic proportions.

    Can they do it? Find out from 2.00pm AEST as we cover all the action with live scores as they happen and if you’re watching, give us your thoughts in the space below.

    Have Your Say

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    The Crowd Says (175)

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    • 5:41am
      Misha said | 5:41am | ! Report

      I wouldn’t take too much notice of Justin Mardhall’s comments – he seems to make a lot of impulsive comments and then after watching the slow motion replay or more sensible advice from a fellow commentator – he retracts his unwise/hasty comment – He made a silly comment about Ritchie McCaw impending a tackler against the Reds but McCaw was fully entlitled to be where he was and the line he was running – Marshall needs to engage brain before mouth a bit more…He also is in danger of what Keith Quinn used to do a lot (bend over backwards for the opposing team) – Its not a good look – Commentating isn’t about evening up the score or opinion or being “kind” to the opposition/other side its about accurate and logical sumamtions..

      • 8:27am
        Sage said | 8:27am | ! Report

        So we know better than an ex AB’s opinion on refereeing against his own countrymen do we ? The point has been clearly made and regardless of which side of the dutch you’re on, that was a hopelessly flawed performance by Lawrence who should never have been given the gme in the first place. McCaw did change his line to impede but that was minor anyway compared to some of the other glaring errors, particularly at scrum time. Lets just agree that Bryce’s use by date has come and gone.

        • 10:25am
          ohtani's jacket said | 10:25am | ! Report

          Mishia has a point. Marshall jumps the gun all the time.

      • 7:11pm
        Damo said | 7:11pm | ! Report

        Misha, the whole point here is about what is accurate and logical.
        And I have seen precious little of it in the highlanders last two games in SA – another one last weekend of a SA visiting team getting caned by a NZ ref pandering to the mob, and then finally the force farce in SA and then Bryce only seeing fit for one front row to be penalized for ‘popping’.
        The whole local referee thing is a sad joke. And it is doing rugby no favours.
        And to all the boneheads who like to ridicule these sentiments with ‘sour grapes’ jibes, what the highlanders and SA travellers copped was no less confounding to this observer than the force’s and reds’ experience.
        Regarding Justin Marshall. I could not notice anything unbalanced in his comments. Something that could not be said about his critics here.

    • 5:25am
      Misha said | 5:25am | ! Report

      Ha ha – welcome Reds to your Dickinson moment!

      • 6:09am
        Red Kev said | 6:09am | ! Report

        They had their “Dickinson” moment last year against the Hurricanes when kiwi ref Keith Brown had a game that made the one Lawrence just had look good.

    • 11:34pm
      Damo said | 11:34pm | ! Report

      Regarding neutral refs.
      I have been shocked in recent weeks at the treatment dished out to NZ teams by local SA referees and then by NZ refs hammering visiting SA teams.
      I was screaming at the TV for what the Scrooges at sanzar bean counting meetings conjured up. Rugby ruin. It had passed being a joke.
      Then after these experiences came Joubert (and his AR with attention deficit) against the Force. And SA commentators explaining away the bias.
      Then came Bryce going further against the Reds than Justin Marshall could bear. At least the NZ commentators could see that the emperor with the whistle had lost his shorts.
      The current refereeing system is making a joke of these away games. It is difficult to take some games seriously.
      One option may be worth considering.
      What if the visiting team brought their own referee? Or if the ref was forced to wear headphones so that instructions from the ignorant mob could be ignored?
      Whatever is done something has to be done.
      Dickenson last year in Oz was contentious as well.
      Come on Sanzar get it together – for the game’s sake.

    • 9:06pm
      Worlds biggest said | 9:06pm | ! Report

      Reds needed to win this one to stay in the mix, looks like it’s the Brumbies carrying the can for the Aussies. This game was always going to be a lottery especially with everyone’s mate reffing. Thought the reds did well to keep it close after the crusaders looked so impressive last week.

    • 8:32pm
      tc said | 8:32pm | ! Report

      I’m a crusaders fan but this ref has to go .(ARE YOU LISTENING IRB)

    • 8:08pm
      Carnivean said | 8:08pm | ! Report

      This sounds like it was a nice, tough game of rugby, and might have been good to watch. 20 minutes in and I could no longer continue to watch. Bryce Lawrence is so ridiculous that it’s impossible to follow the game, no matter which side you support. He’s given stupid penalties both ways already, that for a competent ref wouldn’t even be considered.

      What I really hope happens in the near future is a neutral game, where neither side can be accused of sour grapes, such as Highlanders vs Hurricanes, where Bryce pulls this crap. And then, both sides, and the media pinpoint that he isn’t up to S15 standard. He’s barely even club rugby standard. When people complain about about rugby being a confusing whistle-fest, they are talking about a Bruce game.

      Get fired Bryce. The sooner the better.

    • 7:16pm
      AussieKiwi said | 7:16pm | ! Report

      As a Crusaders fan I think they had the better of the many poor ref decisions which went both ways. They were lucky to get away with the win and will have to lift their game if they are going to be real contenders.

      Re the refs, and leaving apart BL, I don’t think its only a matter of having neutral refs (though that would be preferable) , there is huge crowd pressure and the ref.would not be human if he didn’t give ‘crowd penalties’ sometimes. That’s home ground advantage and the Reds have enjoyed it often enough.

    • 7:01pm
      anopinion said | 7:01pm | ! Report

      I don’t think it is fair to have a go at the ref.

      I would however like to watch each of the scrums that ended in a penalty and try to work out what it was that the ref saw that determined the Reds were driving upwards but the Crusaders were not.

      I hope someone does a video analysis of this and posts it. How can anyone tell who is breaking the laws?
      Perhaps we need to get rid of all scrum rules and just say go for it.

      • 5:31am
        mania said | 5:31am | ! Report

        it was mainly because the aus front row were forced to stand uo, ie they got popped. the dominant scrum should get the penalty by default if the ref doesnt know exactly the cause of collaspe.

        • 6:10am
          Red Kev said | 6:10am | ! Report

          The only reason they stood up was because Franks kept putting his hand on the ground (which by the way is illegal and an automatic penalty) and using it to push up under the Reds front row. Watch the replays, he did it in more than half of the scrums.

          • 6:19am
            mania said | 6:19am | ! Report

            no redKev. yes franks should’ve gotten penalised for hand on the ground but that would’ve been technical. the fact that franks had his hand on the ground and the scrum didnt collaspe is testament to his strengh and technique and then to go on and pop his opposite when he initially suffered some instability shows reds lack of scrum power.

            • 6:25am
              Red Kev said | 6:25am | ! Report

              No it was a Reds attacking scrum at half time and Franks was PUSHING off the ground to keep himself from collapsing (illegal) and then he kept on doing it (he puts his hand down 3 more times) to push up under the Reds front row. That is 100% illegal play.
              It should have been a Reds penalty and ended the half at 8-6 to the Reds instead of 6-5 to the Crusaders.

              That he “initially suffered some instability” shows that he missed the hit and was heading down rather than up at the engage. If you’re gonna comment on scrums at least have packed one in the front row.
              When a prop uses the ground once to stabilise I don’t believe it should be a penalty, but when a prop repeatedly uses the ground and that usage changes the nature of the scrum to dominance – which is exactly what happened as he was able to push up under Slipper – then it is not just a penalty but 10 minutes in the bin.

              • 6:55am
                mania said | 6:55am | ! Report

                so u agree he missed the hit but still managed to pop his opposite? sure it was illegal but the reds didnt take the opportunity to dominate. the hand on the ground means the scrum is initially unstable on the crusaders side. franks stabilised his side and then went on to pop his opposite.
                hand on groundwas definately illegal but the advantage at that stage was to the reds who couldnt capatilise.
                dont lecture me about scrums. i know scrums intimately. I’m not arguing that the hand on ground was illegal. i’m pointing out that despite franks missing the hit and being disadvantaged he still turned it into dominance. getting lower and beign able to push up on the opposite is what every front rower aims for. it gives them the leverage advantage being lower to the ground. duh

              • 7:25am
                Red Kev said | 7:25am | ! Report

                As soon as you put your hand on the ground you lose all rights to win a penalty. You admit Franks was at fault, missing the hit and illegally propping himself off the ground so how do you justify the penalty being given to the Crusaders? You can’t. He turned it into dominance by illegal play, that is easy to do. Reread your last sentence and hopefully you will realise how wrong your statement is. It is easy to win if you don’t play by the rules.

              • 7:29am
                Red Kev said | 7:29am | ! Report

                So your argument is that if you make a mistake and are able to by illegal play then that is right and proper?
                Reread your post, that is exactly what you said.

              • 7:43am
                mania said | 7:43am | ! Report

                redkev – no read slower. i’m saying despite franks losing the initiative and the hit and being initially unstable he still managed to dominate his man. yeah he should’ve been penalised (i’ve said this several times now but you keep ignoring it)for hand on the ground but reds also should’ve capitilised on his instability.
                franks with his hand on the ground was at the disadvantage and reds had the advantage but didnt do anything with it.
                your line “The only reason they stood up was because Franks kept putting his hand on the ground”. this is wrong.reds had the advantage. his hand being on the ground means he shouldnt of been able to recover and pop his man. reds should driven through and not let him recover, but he did and popped his man. it didnt happen because of his hand on the ground, it hapened despite that.
                again, i’m not saying it was legal, i’m saying that despite such a mis time franks showed awesome technique to turn it around and dominate anyway.

              • 7:49am
                Red Kev said | 7:49am | ! Report

                The fact you think that a hand on the ground in that situation is a disadvantage shows that you have never done it. I say again, IT IS EASY TO DOMINATE WHEN YOU USE ILLEGAL PLAY. Using illegal play does show “awesome technique” it shows you are a cheat.

              • 8:00am
                mania said | 8:00am | ! Report

                i wont carry on arguing with u as u have it in your head that hand on ground is an advantage. interesting though wrong

              • 8:14am
                Red Kev said | 8:14am | ! Report

                Puttung your hand on the ground instead of eating grass gives you several advantages:
                – first and foremost it puts the line of any subsequent drive below that achieveable in normal circumstances
                – each time a hand goes down you get to relauch upwards which is the aim of a prop as you point out above
                – the steadying hand on the ground does exactly that, it steadies you when you have lost the ability to.compete with you opposite, it allows you to reset your hips and legs to push and steady the scrum instead of collapsing it (which is why I believe it should not be a penalty offence, but anytime you put your hand on the ground you should lose the rights to win a penalty or even dominance in the scrum, you should be restricted to holding status quo).

                Maybe you are such an awesome prop you have never had to use the ground to do these things, but as a guy who has, let me tell you, you can turn it into an advantage.

              • 8:23am
                mania said | 8:23am | ! Report

                redkev – well u must have sucked as a prop. anytime i see an oppostie with his hand on the ground is the time to attack and pressure and make sure he doesnt have time to recover. he’s unstable so thats the perfect time to apply pressure.
                your rant of the advantages of putting your hand on the ground is only valid if the other prop is just standing there waiting , doing nothing. but then that is the problems with aus front rows. no inititive.

                your continuing on the line that this made a difference to the end result is funny. reds lost because they suck. they were holding onto the a slim lead for most of the game but never dominated. they may have been able to close it out but failed. when they lost the lead they never looked like getting it back or have any ideas on how tproactively get it back

              • 9:23am
                Red Kev said | 9:23am | ! Report

                Welll yes to the first, I was a much better hooker but got fatter and so got moved sideways 😀
                I do not doubt that Franks is a better prop or that on balance the Crusaders scrum was stronger, but a penalty on half.time in kickable range was a big deal. The.Reds probably woukd not have won, the last 15 was all Crusaders, but it was a big momentum changing call.

              • 10:14am
                mania said | 10:14am | ! Report

                i apologise redkev if i came across conceited and gruff.
                it puzzles me with the scrums when teams dont take advantage of the situation. it particularly p’s me off when a prop is boring in and the opposite is letting him. whenever a prop tried to bore into me it gave me the advantage of pushing straight thru him and collasping his side of the scrum. he was at an angle whereas iwas going straight thru him.
                hand on the ground tho is illegal because it makes it unstable. franks shouldnt have gotten away with it but to be able to recover and dominate was impressive. when ever my hand went to ground i had to absolutely stop and restabilise myself and i couldnt push until i was sure i had my balance else i would crumble.

              • 2:05pm
                Cattledog said | 2:05pm | ! Report

                Red Kev, give it up. When you argue with an idiot, they’ll bring you down to their level and beat you with experience 😉

              • 4:09pm
                Red Kev said | 4:09pm | ! Report

                But I like to argue…

        • 10:12am
          anopinion said | 10:12am | ! Report

          From my view. I saw the Crusaders prop getting popped sometimes and the Reds getting popped sometimes, but the penalties did not always go to the popper or the poppie. I do not debate whether the penalties were deserved or that the referee made the correct calls. I am interested in hearing and seeing what the ref saw.

          Personally I thought neither team deserved to be penalised as the ball was playable at the time the whistle blew, “play on”.

    • 6:26pm
      DC of nz said | 6:26pm | ! Report

      The team that took their opportunities won.

      The loser was outplayed in the last ten mins.

      I almost wanted the Reds to win.

      I just don’t know about Bryce. He does seem off the pace.

      Richie, Kieran, DC, Dagg, Franks nicely warming up for another All Black year.

      Todd won’t make back up .. Should Tbe Latimer or Braid.

      • 5:33am
        mania said | 5:33am | ! Report

        DC – reds stayed close for the entriety of this game, though never looked like crossing the saders line. mind u saders didnt score a try!!
        last week when saders also had a close game i thought that they’re just getting into their stride. this week end however i’m wondering whether there a cracks showing in the red and black?

        • 9:42am
          Justin said | 9:42am | ! Report

          Gee I thought they did cross the saders line? Must have been watching something else 😉

          • 10:15am
            mania said | 10:15am | ! Report

            my bad, meant to say that in the 2nd half reds never looked like scoring.

    • 5:15pm
      Misha said | 5:15pm | ! Report

      See lots of Red’s moaners blaming the Ref but the Reds scrum and front row was terrible and deserved every penalty

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