Roar Rookie
Joined August 2010
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From the get go, I need to proclaim that I have never been a fan of Mr Donald and have for some time thought…
My surprise at the venom Robbie Deans receives on here from overnight coaching experts has made me put digits to keyboard in trying to…
Taranaki made the Top6 in the ITM Cup Ben…any new names from there on the EOYT?
got an answer to my example re Henry losing to and then struggling in the next game versus France “C” last year? Didnt he also struggle against Sicilly the following week too?
Ask yourself should a coach with such a great player pool as NZ’s be losing to a France “C” team and struggling V Italy?????????
Dont blame Donald: who subbed him on?
Name a few players Henry developed that were not already on the rise of their own accord? Now we are talking no bodies to somebodies remember so dont give me Sean Fitzy, Zinzan blah blah as they all would have made the AB’s from any other provincial team. cmon?
Dont blame Donald: who subbed him on?
Jerry! Donald struggles at S14!!!!! Hell he got owned in Blenheim 2 years ago at ITM Cup or whatever it was called against some no-body flyhalf from the Mako’s. Another media beat up about Donald being out of his depth in Black but protecting him by stating he is a good flyhalf at S14. The guy is crap down there too. Might produce a good game here and there but certainly not consistent. please reply with some degree of research and competenc and that is my point RIGHT THERE!!! Why does Henry pick him when he has such a vast player pool to choose from that Deans does not. Daniel Braid has only come into favour again not because of his ability but how he has always played fits with the new laws.
I wonder if
Dont blame Donald: who subbed him on?
What a load of rubbish Jerry the test arena is simply not a harder testing ground. Any ITM Cup or S14 coach would kill to have the player pool to choose players from, budgets to pay them and support to coach and train them. Furthermore they have considerable sway over where prospective international players play at S14 or ITM as well as influence over how they as AB’s coaches would like to see NZ rugby via NZRFU high performance coaching play in any given season!! So dont give me the old “oh it is harder for Henry at this level” crap. Furthermore Henrys bad projects or failed player experiments are less to do with the players calibre and more to do with henry not being able to bring the best out of them. Simple fact Jerry unless you too subscribe to the Henry “can walk on water” Destiny Church cheerleader team. Open your eyes man. You like so many think being picked for your national team is the making of you when in fact your making as a player is moulded 1 maybe 2 rungs down otherwise you would have been seeing more Craig Wickes projects being picked for the AB’s from 1st XV??? National coaches and selectors have the luxury and I MEAN LUXURY of choosing from that countries best skilled, mature and experienced personnel. More to the point – Henry has the best player pool to choose from on planet far advanced to Deans or say Marc Lievermont or Warren Gatland. Deans aside lets look at Lievermont aye the fact Henry was beaten in NZ by a French team minus their stars committed to their club final speaks volumes of his ability given all the criteria above. The fact he may not have had key players available to him that game again says more about his development of players to step up, remain committed and motivated than Lievermont possing a better player pool to choose from. I am sure Deans would love Henrys sand-pit but yet with his limited toys he is still able to come close on recent occassions and now beat Henry on his terms, no fluke no refereeing bias. The fact is Henry has always been in possession of a ferrari but has struggled with the gear shift for some time. Citreon seem to spoil his podium appearances and now the Holden team seem to have his measure. The fact is every now and then he does get his car through all the gears but on the odd ocassion he struggles to get his car out of 2nd gear. We saw what happened when he drove the Ferarri like a Camry in Cardiff in 07 and his reliance on his 3rd and 4th gear driving (Carter & McCaw) or rather inability to use these gears has been shown up by the old used Citroen last year. Given his reliance on his two “key” gears if one broke down mid race does he have a strategy to win the race this time around or should we be looking for a driver who can use all the gears of the NZ rugby Ferarri.
Dont blame Donald: who subbed him on?
Jerry I thnk you’ll find Senio made the AB’s from BoP via Deans mentoring at the Crusaders, so was this supporting your point or mine?
OJ the issue is whether Deans is a better coach than Henry based around where players have gone after being under their respective watches. Deans may very well have propelled to the AB’s some ordinary AB’s but he never picked them for the AB’s Henry did. He was great for getting ordinary players to play out of their skin. Henry was not.
Dont blame Donald: who subbed him on?
Deans turns coal into diamonds. Henry turns diamonds into …well you decide? How many players has he tried out in Black that have never featured again and in fact have got worse? The word limit on here negates me even trying.
Give me one player that has gone from good to bad under Deans’s watch?
Dont blame Donald: who subbed him on?
I think i refer to you Jason in my last paragraph above. Results dont always equal best coach.I dont think Jake White is a better coach than Henry yet he won a WC and Henry was on a plane home before the semi’s were kicked off. Deans is streets ahead of Henry as a coach. Wayne Smith is on par with Deans but Henry and Hansen are the benefactors of an exceptional player pool which hides alot of their deficiencies. I have displayed a few above re man management. Make no mistake the two most important coaches in the AB’s camp are Smith and Mike Cron.
Dont blame Donald: who subbed him on?
Totally agree with you in that the Wallabies won the game as opposed to what alot of kiwis here are saying that we lost it. Mute point. My grudge is with the rationale and credentials of Henry and Smith to know the internal machinations of a player to know his body better than the player himself. Carter himself was quoted in a post match interview as saying “I was good to stay on” Why didnt Henry ask him via their sideline comm’s/water boy? We saw this breakdown in comm’s from Henry to McCaw during the French quarter-final last WC didnt we? I said you said? Chinese whispers…. when the crap hits the fan the only consistent thing we hear outta Camp Henry is “not our fault” Should we be worried? I think so!
Dont blame Donald: who subbed him on?
No Darwin I have been critical of Henry since pre last WC with his lack of transparncy and general man management. The incident surrounding Weepu’s exclusion from the WC squad was a huge beat up by AB’s management to drop him. At the time he wasnt playing any worse than Kelleher or the Waikato kid but is hung out to dry because he was at a bar mid week (of a test week) not drinking even though he wasnt part of the Test squad?? AB’s management didnt point out that so were several other players in the WC squad not involved in the upcoming test out and about ALL that week out for dinner at bars. Henry spouts something about bad attitude yet the great redeemer himself is helped into a cab pissed from a Cardiff restaurant 2 days before our exit against France!
Then there is his management of the Nick Evans debacle taking his eye off the ball in an attempt to keep Carter from going to France but yeah if there was one incident that did rankle with me it was the way he managed himself through the interview process for the AB’s job post the last WC.
I actually was one of the few that wanted to give him another go even though I am a Deans fan. But for him to not enter the race without the need for him to “know the numbers” first ..ie…backroom lobbying with the NZRFU board while simultaneously Deans publicly severes his ties with ChCh, turns down ONeil’s approaches publicly stating that he wants the AB’s job first basically “putting himself out there” shows the measure of the two dont you think? Context Henrys actions through this against a backdrop of public sentiment to send him to coach the Antarctic XV – I thought he needed to win back some degree of respect not from his fans but AB’s fans even considering he lauded what was it?? “judge me on my results”
Sure for the vast majority of kiwis all they care about is results and maybe that speaks more toward the fickle-ness of our general populous here but as a dad to twin 3 year old boys I can easily see which of the two has personal values I hold in high regard… and i havent even started on his coaching cock-ups yet?
Dont blame Donald: who subbed him on?
Did you read above Jerry? Henry didnt mould those players as they would have made the AB’s from any other first divison team playing at the time and further champ if your going to use wiki to support your rant at least look at where many of these guys were actually discovered? Many Like I say ALL of these guys would have maded the AB’s from any other First Div team then – Henry didnt make them! laughable hahahaha
The direct contrast being ordinary players like Scott Hamilton, Sam Broomhall, Ben Blair and more WOULD NOT have played AB’s under any other NZ coach. Thanks for reminding me of that fact.
Dont blame Donald: who subbed him on?