By rugbyfuture -
December 19th 2009 @ 2:12am
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What should new Super Rugby team be called?
Wikipedia is the scourge of teachers, as it provides both hard information and general speculation. Browsing through the Super 14 page at Wikipedia, I saw that the Rebels (Australian rugby championship side) were put onto the roster as the Super 15 team.
As well as this, the Rebels page was changed to refer to it as the Super 15 team. I am still not sure of the team’s name, but I know that the new team was not the same entity as the ARC team.
This has to be a contentious issue to any of you Victorian rugby fans out there: good naming and branding is a must. But John O’Neil has come out and said he would prefer a new name, possibly chosen by the public.
Victoria as a State has a distinct lack of appropriate mascots, and it is hard to see, from a New South Welshman’s perspective, as to what an appropriate name could be.
I don’t like the Rebels name. But what’s everyone’s opinion on the team’s new name?
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(72)
Bay35Pablo said | December 19th 2009 @ 9:41am | Report comment
Victoria are more likely to stick with the Rebels if JON doesn’t want it!
I don’t mind the Rebels, and it already has some goodwill behind it.
Various other names have been raised on the threads when Melbourne won the spot, many of which weren’t worthy.
If the cricket team didn’t already have it, I’d say the Bushrangers.
Just as long as it isn’t some wanky marketing term like Force …..
siva samoa said | December 19th 2009 @ 10:22am | Report comment
I would love to see the team call Victoria Rebels so when they take on the Queensland Reds and NSW it has that state vs state theme into it and make it more interesting.
sheek said | December 19th 2009 @ 10:36am | Report comment
I am surprised some people have a problem with the nickname ‘Rebels’.
For starters, it is entirely appropriate to the history of Victoria, which I’ve explained on a number of previous occasions. And for seconds, it would compliment the cricket state team, known as the Bushrangers.
If someone can come up with an improvement on Rebels, I’ll accept it, but right now, Rebels is head, shoulders, torso, waist & feet above any other suggestion I’ve heard.
Victoria Rebels.
I have to say it’s more appropriate than either Queensland Reds (Maroons?) or WA Force (state bird is a black swan).
siva samoa said | December 19th 2009 @ 3:10pm | Report comment
I like the Rebels name for the Victorian team but those not familiar with rugby will think its might have a connection to the bikie gang.
Bunratty c said | December 19th 2009 @ 12:31pm | Report comment
Gold Diggers?
mcxd said | December 20th 2009 @ 7:34am | Report comment
nice… the cheers leaders could be an intresting collection. a whole lot of mutton dressed as lamb with bling.
Timmypig said | December 19th 2009 @ 12:34pm | Report comment
I dunno, what about ….. ummmm ….. “Melbourne”, or “Victoria”. Why not break from the (vulgarly recent) past and leap into the future. I can picture it now: plain jersey, no flashy logos, Victorian state or Melbourne city coat of arms on the left breast, and let the name develop organically over years.
I know – it’s a bit futuristic and out there! But what a stunning concept!
rugbyfuture said | December 19th 2009 @ 1:11pm | Report comment
sponsorships would be harder
Chris said | December 19th 2009 @ 1:32pm | Report comment
You need sometime for people to yell out at the game: “Up the Rebels”.
“Go Melbourne” or “Go Victoria” just sound pretentious. Besides – the Brumbies have shown that a mascot doesn’t need to be something thought up by a marketer.
As long as its nothing like the “Force” (particularly ironic for a team that has been – for lack of a better word – s***house) I say go for it.
Gary said | December 19th 2009 @ 3:45pm | Report comment
That would be the “S***house” team that beat the Brumbies the Tahs and the Reds last season, the only Australian team to achieve the trifecta.
Chris said | December 20th 2009 @ 10:56am | Report comment
Yes – the same “s***house” team that have never made the finals, have a negative win loss ratio (even at home), and have just lost their best 2 players.
I love how Force fans define the pinnacle of Rugby as the (recently invented) “Aussie Grand Slam”. Most teams define it as actually winning the comp.
Gary said | December 19th 2009 @ 3:43pm | Report comment
The Melbourne Drizzle
Master Blaster said | December 19th 2009 @ 4:16pm | Report comment
I went to Phillip Island once. Call them the Melbourne Penquins.
stash said | December 19th 2009 @ 6:17pm | Report comment
Gold is quite good
Rebels is a bit convictee – I think the Australian public are a bit sensitive about that (and we’ve had enough rugby rebels in the last few months thanks)
How about Bitter – that could have a good sponsor tie-in…. hmmm maybe not
Ummm…the Nutters… or the Hooligans… the wombats…. the Smash and Grabs…. the Tormentors… the Doormats
The Kickers (no that would be the SA team)
So many choices
stash said | December 19th 2009 @ 8:36pm | Report comment
While I’m being culturally insensitive – if it was a kiwi team it could be the Fellas (see we can laugh at ourselves)
Republican said | December 19th 2009 @ 8:14pm | Report comment
Just remember, no matter what you call them, this generic team will NOT represent Vic or Melbourne since they will be made up of players from all over the globe, which is even more of a farce than the Force who’s side was, from it’s inception a Qld B line up in the main.
Call them the ‘Globe Trotters’ ?
rugbyfuture said | December 20th 2009 @ 11:02am | Report comment
thats what proffesionalism is, it is hoped that they can still represent the state thats playing, you seem very cynical of everything around here, gain some pride in representation, this aint a political forum, its a sports forum
san jorge said | December 20th 2009 @ 1:54pm | Report comment
You mean like the swans or lions represent Sydney and Melbourne??
Master Blaster said | December 19th 2009 @ 8:47pm | Report comment
Melbourne Cuckoos. Because they will be nesting in a stadium built by the hard work of the Storm and Victory.
siva samoa said | December 20th 2009 @ 6:53am | Report comment
What did the Storm do to help with building the stadium ? I know alot of the Storms players are qualified brickies and labourers .
rugbyfuture said | December 20th 2009 @ 11:02am | Report comment
i do believe that the Rugby Union training and development camp is based there over any of the others
PastHisBest said | December 20th 2009 @ 4:37pm | Report comment
Not true SS…none of them are qualified…
Davo said | December 20th 2009 @ 9:00am | Report comment
As a Victorian fan, I think the general feeling at grass roots level here is that we’re pretty happy with the name Rebels. I think it’s mildly ironic that people outside of Victoria feel they have a better of what we should be called than we do ourselves.
The Rebels was chosen in 2006 for the ARC comp after polling of local fans. The general feeling was that it fitted with the Victorian rugby personality. Our rugby community has always abided quietly, surviving against what seems like the overwhelming odds of AFL and recenlty the Storm. It embodies the fact that, yeah, we;re the underdogs that no one thinks much of, but we don’t care. In fact, that’s the way we like it.
In addition the Rebels already has currency in the Melbourne rugby community. We’re proud of the fact that we came second in the ARC. It’s also worth knownig the imagery is in keeping with our senior club rugby side in Melbourne which is known as the Axemen and of course the Vic Bushrnagers which are our Shield cricket team.
So, to be honest, I’m more than happy to keep the name. In fact, I carefully kept my Rebels tie and Jersey from the 2007 ARC and am looking forward to dusting them off in 2011.
AndyS said | December 21st 2009 @ 1:53pm | Report comment
It is that link to the ARC team that JO’N / the ARU doesn’t like, and the name would constantly remind them
Redb said | December 22nd 2009 @ 1:00am | Report comment
Nothing wrong with the ‘Rebels’.
cookie said | December 20th 2009 @ 9:33am | Report comment
Surely there has to be something better than rebels?
I mean it’s rather blase? Rebels without a cause…..
I just hope they don’t come up with some moronic name like the rams or dolphins or titans or storm they are just plain tacky and common.
rugbyfuture said | December 20th 2009 @ 11:04am | Report comment
i liked the rams
Matt said | December 20th 2009 @ 10:32am | Report comment
If the Rebels name was chosen for the ARC side based on a public poll, then if JON wants a name (preferably new) chosen by the public then why would the fans not choose the Rebels name again?
I just feel the desire to ditch the Rebels name by JON is more because it was born under someone else watch and reminds people of the ARC (which I’m sure JON would love to forget).
Barking Glider said | December 20th 2009 @ 11:02am | Report comment
Melbourne Eurekas.
“Eurekas!”
sheek said | December 20th 2009 @ 11:14am | Report comment
Obviously, seriousness has disappeared from this debate, which is a little disappointing…..
Rugbyfuture – I must confess Rams is a bit bland, even when adopted by Western Sydney ARC team, but at least it was historically appropriate to them.
Matt – I think you’ve nailed JON’s motive – he doesn’t like any idea that didn’t have his imprint.
rugbyfuture said | December 20th 2009 @ 11:53am | Report comment
the rams name just needed a bit of brand flair added to it, it was historical, had a link, good colours, appropriate for rugby, not in use sumwhere else, other than in juniors like Epping, but i c your point in hte appearance of being a bit bland, still better than spirit, aces, fleet or tornadoes
KF said | December 20th 2009 @ 9:06pm | Report comment
Hi
I am afraid that Rebels is still better than Victorian Axemen (the actual Victoria’s Rugby Union Senior Representative team name)..
Kind regards
KF
Roscoe said | December 21st 2009 @ 7:32am | Report comment
Won’t be the Rams- local club are known as Rams and are a long way from being popular here as they are adept at “recruiting” the good players from developing clubs! Rebels it is.
Republican said | December 21st 2009 @ 12:24pm | Report comment
rugbyfuture
Politics and sport are synonomous, moreso than ever before and culture is what drives the tribal factor otherwise there would be no sport.
san jorge
I think you will find that both the Lions and Swans have their fair share of Qld and NSW content respectively.
I also might add that many more play Aust Footy in these states than do rugby Union or League in Vic.
This Union folly is a top down way of growing codes and is driven purley by a corporate criteria that may or may not work long term. In the interim, to call this team Victorian is simply farcical and nothing but an illusion (ala Force) that some may be willing to swallow, in order to glean any tribalism possible for the game to survive in Melbourne.
rugbyfuture said | December 21st 2009 @ 12:57pm | Report comment
actually the swans in their draft rejected most to all sydney players for outside state players, also, dont group league and union in the same vein, they are seperate games with, as you say, different political agendas and cultural ties, of which, victoria have somewhat of a tradition in Rugby Union, which by and large cooperated with Melbourne Rules teams in the early years. One could argue that since politics and sport are synonymous, that since Australia and Especially Melbourne and Sydney are cities founded on immigrants that in all occasions, when a team brings players into reach with the community, they are just as local as any other family or hero, in any sport
Redb said | December 22nd 2009 @ 12:59am | Report comment
That is incorrect. The Swans picked up a NSW player just recently in the Dec 15 rookie draft.
rugbyfuture said | December 22nd 2009 @ 1:12am | Report comment
a
Roscoe said | December 21st 2009 @ 12:45pm | Report comment
Republican- the “rebels” will have some Victorians from the start. Ever heard of Ioane, Llelifano (spelling?), Horua? Plus Tala Grey (brumbies) and Tapui (reds) will be big chances to come home as well. Four Vic boys in Aussie Schoolboys (Esekia/Paila/DeGuingand/Hamilton). Yes, majority from elsewhere but there will be a Victorian presence now and in the future.
sportfreak said | December 21st 2009 @ 1:00pm | Report comment
ignore Republican gang
He has a pro-AFL streak ( dugh!) and loves trawling the rugby sites inserting his little pearls of wisdom on why rugby ( both codes) are in trouble.
How are thoseAFL TV ratings going republican? How about the Swannies picking a massive ZERO NSW players in the draft as they weren’t up to scratch. How about the fact that Irishmen who have never played the game before are picked ahead of the local talent
Here’s a little quiz for you. How many WA raised rugby players are contracted in the Force in 2010? Its less than 30 but more than 1.
AFL is going to lose a fortune in Western Sydney and I am going to love watching every last minute of it.
Swans TV ratings are down 19% this year champion and set to fall faster than their position on the ladder in 2010. Face it the ‘curiosity’ boom is over. Swannies back to the laughing stock of NSW sport.
Brett McKay said | December 21st 2009 @ 1:07pm | Report comment
SF, in Republican’s defence, his concerns about the decline of rugby, based on what he sees for himself, are generally quite well-meant and genuine. I don’t agree with him regularly (including this case right here – the new S15 team HAS to be called Victoria), but that doesn’t make him any more or less wrong than any of us.
Let’s not turn this into personal attacks, or descend it into yet another episode of the Code Wars…
Crashy said | December 21st 2009 @ 1:02pm | Report comment
Ah you make me laugh Republican,
Any glance on the AFL section of The Roar, ( yes there is one) shows where your true love lies. Why bother, it makes you look like Oikee…
Master Blaster said | December 21st 2009 @ 1:04pm | Report comment
Cowboys v Redskins next week in the NFL. Always find that an unfortunate match up of badly named teams!
Brett McKay said | December 21st 2009 @ 1:11pm | Report comment
MB, I always thought the NRL should make more of the Knights-Dragons thing whenever Newcastle and St.George/Illawarra play, but they still seem to be stuck on The Battle of the Steel Cities…
Master Blaster said | December 21st 2009 @ 1:25pm | Report comment
Too esoteric for them. No one in the NRL has read the classics. They seem to enjoy bigging up the Panthers and Tigers cat fight though.
Roscoe said | December 21st 2009 @ 1:06pm | Report comment
That’s classic! Well spotted!
sportfreak said | December 21st 2009 @ 1:19pm | Report comment
OK – BF
It just seems that no matter what the subject ( with the underlying theme of course being Rugby), good ol Repub comes along with views and crocodile tears on why Rugby is dying. It is getting quite tiresome actually.
Just becasue the popularity of a sport can ebb and flow does not mean it is dying – look at AFL in ACT, where it was once very strong.
Do you really think his concerns are genuine when there is a pro-AFL bias?
Brett McKay said | December 21st 2009 @ 1:27pm | Report comment
I know, I don’t disagree with you, and I’ve had many similar “conversations” with Republican about this. Over time, I’ve come to like the fact that he continues to keep putting this message across, such is his concern about it. But again, that doesn’t mean I agree with everything he says, because while I’m a lot more open to his suggestions, I still believe things aren’t as bad as he makes out.
There’s nothing wrong with contrary opinions, and the healthy debate that results, but I’m just saying we don’t need to go down to the schoolyard level…
Bay35Pablo said | December 21st 2009 @ 1:24pm | Report comment
As schoolmaster sheek said above, no more joking. Eyes front and centre, backs straight, sit up!!!
Victoria’s emblems are (from Wikipedia):
– Floral Common Heath
– Aquatic Weedy Seadragon
– Bird Helmeted Honeyeater
– Faunal Leadbeater’s possum
– Colours Navy Blue and Silver
So the Victorian Heaths, Seadragons, Honeyeaters, or Possums don’t really float my marketing dream boat …
The Victorian Leadbellies are a bit obtuse (Ned Kelly, and the original book for Underbelly).
Rebels was a public choice, and it has the conntations of the Eureka Stockade.
Given Victoria did play interstate rugby quite competitively up until WW2, did they have a nickname? Given NSW were known as the Waratahs from the 1920s, surely the Vics have a nickname they can dust off and use to get the tradition going again?
Brett McKay said | December 21st 2009 @ 1:56pm | Report comment
Pablo, I think like Heart/Hearts for the new A-League team, I think ‘Rebels’ just has such an awareness about it already that to go with anything different would be crazy. Even more so when we consider that the ARU and especially John O’Neill don’t like it. All the more reason to keep it, I’d reckon…
I’d even keep the same strip they used in the ARC; it’s distinctly Victorian, and was the best strip in the ARC by a considerable distance (though admittedly, it wasn’t a strong field…)
Master Blaster said | December 21st 2009 @ 1:26pm | Report comment
The Origin teams are just colours. Maybe the Melbourne Teales is the go?
Crashy said | December 21st 2009 @ 1:39pm | Report comment
being Victorian ( when it suits) allows me a view on this.
Clearly a lot of the Rugby played in Victoria is in the private schools and universities.
So how about these…
Melbourne Blue Bloods
Victorian old money
Melbourne w@nk@s
Victorian Tally Hos
Roscoe said | December 21st 2009 @ 1:42pm | Report comment
Crashy as a true Victorian I can assure you the strength is in the clubs. Vic U16s 2009- 4 private school boys, 19 from club rugby. Vic 14s 2 private school boys, 21 club.
sportfreak said | December 21st 2009 @ 1:46pm | Report comment
OK BF understood.
Still trying to work out Republican in his final paragraph..
This Union folly is a top down way of growing codes and is driven purley by a corporate criteria that may or may not work long term. In the interim, to call this team Victorian is simply farcical and nothing but an illusion (ala Force) that some may be willing to swallow, in order to glean any tribalism possible for the game to survive in Melbourne.
Vic – has an established Rugby comp ( albeit amateur), the the top private schools play the game ( these schools are big not necessarily academically the best) and there is a connection with the business community and university system.
How is establishing a rugby team there any different from plonking South Melbourne in Sydney and Fitzroy in QLD. You can’t say that anyone in Sydney new anything about VFL back then.
I am on not denying that the actions of the ARU in recent years have been nothing short of a disgrace ( buying idiots like Rogers) but in growing teams in non-heartland areas is hardly a phenominon secular to rugby!
Brett McKay said | December 21st 2009 @ 2:21pm | Report comment
completely agree Sportfreak, I don’t how you could put a team in Melbourne and NOT attach Victoria to it (notwithstanding Reds Fan’s point below about geographic names), and expect people to identify with it. And anyway, in this day and age of professional players, not being Victorian is hardly going to stop a player from signing on.
And I’m sorry if I’ve come across all school-teachery here, I just hate seeing these discussions turn down the same tiring road all the time. Thankfully, this one’s getting back on track.
Go Rebels!!
Crashy said | December 21st 2009 @ 1:50pm | Report comment
I like to hear it Roscoe.
I myself will embrace the Vic team as my second and will ensure a pilgrammage every 2 years to Melbourne.
How about just Victoria? Or
Victorian Southerns
reds fan said | December 21st 2009 @ 2:07pm | Report comment
We need to remember that, for better or for worse, the naming convention for Super Rugby is nickname only. No geographic reference is used. This is due to multiple provinces being part owners in the NZ and SA Super Rugby teams.
So it would be simply “Rebels”.
Jameswm said | December 21st 2009 @ 1:59pm | Report comment
Mexicans?
AndyS said | December 21st 2009 @ 2:01pm | Report comment
Given that Union survived there despite VFL/AFL, maybe the Barnacles or Cockroaches?
reds fan said | December 21st 2009 @ 2:26pm | Report comment
How about the “Espresso’s”?
God knows they are always going on about how they have the best coffee in the country.
reds fan said | December 21st 2009 @ 2:28pm | Report comment
What about the “Rattlers”? isn’t that what they call trams (or is it trains)? also conjures up images of big hits…
Brett McKay said | December 21st 2009 @ 2:33pm | Report comment
..and desert snakes…
reds fan said | December 21st 2009 @ 2:38pm | Report comment
yeah thats no good. and i think i’m gtting mixed up with red rattlers which were the old sydney trains…
Republican said | December 21st 2009 @ 4:12pm | Report comment
Roscoe
Vic pales compared to the ACT in that respect yet these days you would be lucky to find any ACT lads palying in the Oz Schools side and that’s with the Brumby’s presence over more than a decade. A changing of the guard perhaps but I look at those Vic names and can’t help but notice that without exception, they are of PI and Maori heritage. I suppose that this ethnic group is what keeps Union afloat in Oz and with Kiwi migration on the increase, that’s got to be good for the game here long term.
Sportfreak
There is alot of Oz Footy elite talent spread throughout the League hailing from NSW, Qld and the ACT, the latter interestingly enough producing more elite AFL than Union these days. I actually have quite a long and illustrious past in supporting Union however, it is true I do prefer Australian Football. I believe i am consistent in my crit of the top down corporate approach to growth in sport these days whether this be pertaining to Union, League or my beloved Australian Footy and any naming charade such as this is fair game I reckon, since it is part and parcel of a culture I simply feel compelled to challenge..
I think you will find that Union and League are not at all adverse to recruiting athletes from opposing codes also.
Brett, a scholar and a gentleman as always.
Cheers
rugbyfuture said | December 21st 2009 @ 11:57pm | Report comment
funny your last comments, i always thought that the code wars always existed mainly as everyone versus league and that Rugby, AFL and Soccer could one day work out with eachother because they are all very different athletes, whereas League tends to dab in the grounds of the other three sports. Soccer the world game, Rugby the international Contact code and Rugby code and AFL as the national code.
Roscoe said | December 22nd 2009 @ 6:26am | Report comment
Republican: firstly Paila and Esekia are of PI background. Hamilton and DeGuingand could not be more Anglo- Scotch College and StKevins boys.
Re Aussie Rules boys changing to rugby you clearly know nothing about Vic local rugby. In Vic 16s Nankivell and Mathers are both private school boys who have played at TAC U16 level and moved to rugby for it’s physicality and comaraderie. They are currently in UK on Vic Schools U16 tour.
Yes, big PI population in rugby schools but please don’t tell me- a 40 year involvement in Vic rugby- about who plays in Victoria.
Republican said | December 22nd 2009 @ 10:24am | Report comment
Roscoe
A 40 year involvement hey, that means you will be well aware of the VRU’s mercenary piggy backing on the ACTRU in collaboration with Brumby Rugby and the ARU over many years, not to mention their covert and unrelenting campaign to poach the Brumby’s to satisfy their somewhat inflated sense of themselves.
Of course they can probably put that one to bed since they now have their own franchise in satisfying their ego. Their ability to glean so much support from the Union community here has certainly paid dividends and I am well aware of the percenatge of Vic Schools rep in the Oz side this year, which is very positive for the game in Australia but how ironic that the ACT GR’s and Schools pedigree is but a distant memory at the same time as Vic’s promise of a burgeoning future in this respect.
In an unprecedented result, there were diddly ACT players selected in the Oz Schools side to tour the UK and Ireland with this number ominously shrinking over the last five years. The ACT Schools side has been finishing bottom and winless in the Nationals for about three years now and will be relegated to the Div Two, mark my words, once Vic and WA are able to offer a stand alone rep side, which is nigh I believe.
I can safely say there is a bit of resentment in these parts towards Vic rugby, however I do not disagree with your sentiments entirely and would hope that any potential in a demographic of 4mill and gowing, in deriving some talent would be forthcoming.
That said, this still pales compared to what this region has contributed to this code over many years and although you probably think this all sounds a little like sour grapes, you may like to put yourself in the ongoing vulnerable shoes of the ACT to appreciate what little future the game now has in this corporately insignificant and always expediently treated little town.
To finish, St Kevins was once a great AFL nursery, my father went there. I went to St Eddies which was a great Union nursery. It would seem we are witnessing a changing of the guard Roscoe.
Cheers and a happy X’y to you and your’s
Roscoe said | December 22nd 2009 @ 10:43am | Report comment
Republican:
yes, we have jumped on the bandwagon with ACT for a number of reasons:
1. As “mexicans” we can not support Waratahs and it’s too far to Brisbane. Many of us travel to Canberra each year to support/watch the Brumbies. I know your pubs/clubs appreciate us!
2. Yes, we were hoping to “entice” the Brumbies franchise south after the Force was created. Guilty as charged.
3. The Brumbies have given our junior programs support with regular games (Vic has won 12/14/16 games last two years) and also send coaches down for development camps. Appreciated and acknowledged.
4. Brumbies and ACT club rugby have many ex Vics in their playing ranks as our blokes have left to have a crack at Super 14 rugby. Don’t blame them- oh to be 25 years younger!
By the way Victoria U18s have been accepted into Div 1 in 2010 as you mentioned was on the cards. Having watched the U16 Nationals I understand ACT supporters frustration. Some real talent but not producing under pressure. They were in front at half time in all games- including Sydney Juniors but lost every game.
Mate- I hope we are seeing a changing of the guard in that Vic rugby grows- just hope ACT doesn’t fall over.
Have a good Xmas, look forward to further debates in the New Year!
Brett McKay said | December 22nd 2009 @ 11:02am | Report comment
Roscoe (and Republican) – for what it’s worth, I actually think it’s in the VRU and ACTRU’s interests to maintain the knowledge-sharing relationship, even with the Vics getting a Super team now. Something about smaller Unions teaming up to take on the world.
Just a thought to leave with you…
A merry Christmas to Roarers near and far, I look forward to maintaining the rage in 2010!!
Dogs Of War said | December 29th 2009 @ 5:48pm | Report comment
http://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/rugby/super-14/3198178/Melbourne-rugby-franchise-not-so-super
The new Melbourne Super 15 franchise is in disarray with investors pulling out after failing to agree to terms with the Australian Rugby Union over funding.
Members of the VicSuper15 group, who were involved in the winning bid for the new licence in the expanded 2011 competition, have “ceased negotiations” with the ARU, according to spokesman Ray Evans.
He said the group had European Cup-winning Australian coach Michael Cheika, who is currently with Irish side Leinster, lined up to coach Melbourne, and “possibly (Wallaby skipper) Rocky Elsom” but was unsure if that would now eventuate.
Mining magnate Kevin Maloney, one of the main backers of the franchise, is among investors to walk away saying the operation isn’t viable.
The parties reached an impasse over funding, with the ARU unwilling to match an annual grant of $4.2m to the existing Australian Super sides.
They initially offered A$2.1m which was upped to $3m but members of VicSuper15 say it’s insufficient.
The Melbourne side was set to be the first privately-funded franchise in a departure from traditional state-owned Super rugby teams, however if the ARU runs the team it will put it in a position of conflict of interest with the other state-run sides.
“They won’t provide parity so we’ve basically said it’s not commercial,” Evans said.
“They’re going to set it up now and hope that somebody’s going to pay for it and make money out of it, I don’t know how they’re going to make it work.
“That’s the major sticking point, that they weren’t prepared to provide the same amount of TV rights as the other states.”
Another investor, media buyer Harold Mitchell, is also said to be disillusioned with the ARU offering but is attempting to continue negotiations.
While the ARU will give the franchise a dispensation on the number of foreign players it can recruit, allowing up to 10, it’s understood investors are concerned how they will pay for such players.
They are also wary of other costs such as marketing a new rugby franchise in the AFL heartland.
Evans said the ARU should look at the AFL, who are providing hefty financial and player concessions for the start-up of new franchises Gold Coast and Western Sydney.
“The ARU are trying to get us to start it up without any start-up costs and at a reduced income stream,” Evans said.
Another VicSuper15 spokesman Travis Atkins said investors could be lured back if the ARU came to the table.
“Starting up a new team obviously makes it important that there’s enough funding to do it in terms of support from the governing body as well as private equity, it’s a commercial venture not philanthropy,” he said.
“We want to move forward but under reasonable and rational terms.”
Joining the competition in 2011, the window of opportunity to recruit a top-level coach and first-class players is quickly closing.
“We had a coach lined up, we had Michael Cheika lined up to come from Leinster and probably Rocky Elsom, I don’t know what’s going to happen now,” Evans said.
_____________________
The ARU have a special talent of screwing things up. It is going to be a struggle to carve out a niche, yet the ARU wants to make it even harder than it need be. BT Why did I have to find this in a NZ newspaper, why can’t I find it in an Australian one?
John Ryan said | December 29th 2009 @ 6:25pm | Report comment
It also made the West Australian this morning
rugbyfuture said | December 29th 2009 @ 7:00pm | Report comment
well this sucks, just before christmas i gave the vicsuper15 team a logo to use, directly with a positive response from travis atkins, this might just be a glitch in negotiations? maybe the ARU and JON will come to their senses……
….maybe not.
Timmypig said | December 29th 2009 @ 7:26pm | Report comment
The ‘Oxos’ – because the ARU have made this whole thing a laughing stock …..
boom tish!