The Roar
The Roar

Brendan NH Fan

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Joined July 2022

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So true. I heard one report going off about how the commentator was complaining it wasn’t enough like league or words to that effect. A big think up here for rugby was Sky in the early days of the Champions Cup. They told you it was the best ever and the competition every year was crowds are up x%. SRP rarely seems to be about the teams or growth of any kind, it’s all look at the crowds or X team shouldn’t be here which only drives people away.

The Wrap: ‘World’s best provincial rugby competition’ delivers a superb Super Round

With the accounts SARU posted last year it is a good place to be. I am sure they have a plan but you would figure Cheetahs, Puma’s and Griquas will be making noises in 2026 if nothing happens.

'Ready to go': Jaguares set for early return to Super Rugby if Rebels fall over

They should have got people from the sevens in to promote it, its not about the rugby its the festival side. Just not sure why Saders or teams like that would not want to play infornt of their home fans and tell SRP people/Unions to go pick someone else to lose a home game.

The Wrap: ‘World’s best provincial rugby competition’ delivers a superb Super Round

If the WBs have to be rested as part of the payment and RA call the shots when does that change whose responsible. I know each country is different but up here if you call the shots you are the employer. Being paid by a third party or splitting your wage between two companies doesn’t always work out well for the company not in trouble as it show they are connected. As a large percent of Rebels income comes from RA that wouldn’t help either. Might be different in OZ. All the articles of RA personnel saying how they had agreed terms with players to keep them in Oz wouldn’t be helpful either.

Why things could be about to get even uglier for Rugby Australia in fallout over Rebels debacle

While RA and the states are sperate they are not at the same time. Will a judge view RA as having the SRP sides paying taxes that RA should have been paying and were liable for. Are the top ups to play SRP or are they to play for the WBs.

Why things could be about to get even uglier for Rugby Australia in fallout over Rebels debacle

Big question for me is are the top up negotiated by RA or by the Rebels. If by RA then they are liable for it surely as the Rebels would not have agreed. While SRP teams might pay the PAYE tax when it comes to things like this who wonts the contract the tax relates to will be expected to pay the bills (Brumbies and Red may also send bills if it deemed RA are liable for it)

Why things could be about to get even uglier for Rugby Australia in fallout over Rebels debacle

I can’t understand how after 2017 RA didn’t have yearly sit downs with the Rebels to look at finances and the previous results, the fact they were shocked there was a $10m hole that grew and grew over a few weeks tells you all you need to know about what trouble RA have in all this and what they are hiding

Why things could be about to get even uglier for Rugby Australia in fallout over Rebels debacle

If the Brumbies aren’t the long term answer where they are why would having to remove all the commercial partners and fans and go to a place where the last team got less fans and less money is going to work. Vic Rugby should set up a regional team that plays with a wage bill of about $2-3m and build it up over 10 years. Bankrupting the Brumbies will not fix the problem.

Why things could be about to get even uglier for Rugby Australia in fallout over Rebels debacle

Are the Rebels Directors focused on bringing down RA or are they like the other Unions apart from the Tahs wondering why they have to suddenly stick $8m creditor for RA when they were told it seems that it was not loans. That is what kicked it all off. While the rest of the debt is still two big you would figure $12m wouldn’t be a millions miles away from 1005 of income. RA basically lumped the 4 SRP sides with $24-32m between them and created $24-32m of debtors. This was probably to secure the loan facility of $80m or the increase to $120m. I would be ticked too if RA blamed me for problems they too were doing but were hiding.

Why things could be about to get even uglier for Rugby Australia in fallout over Rebels debacle

Will just be back here in 2030 if they carry on under the current model even if given $10m nest egg to start off with.

Why things could be about to get even uglier for Rugby Australia in fallout over Rebels debacle

Rugby Australia could be in really big trouble here. Not only do the Rebels believe that they are owed money so do the Brumbies and Reds who would happily see the pain on RA if they had to pay it out. While RA may view itself as a separate entity the links between RA and Rebels could well be hashed out in the courts. RA having to pay out $18m to the Rebels creditors, the Brumbies and the Reds will definitely more than dipping in (though they already might be waist deep). I think RA want this over as quickly as possible because the can has a lot of worms and the Rebels are dead so what’s a few more.

Why things could be about to get even uglier for Rugby Australia in fallout over Rebels debacle

But the two Unions won’t move games if not cost effective.

The Wrap: ‘World’s best provincial rugby competition’ delivers a superb Super Round

As an NH fan I don’t get the Super Round, why take away one of only 7 regular home matches from the NZ based sides and move them out of the country. I know the money is good but does it help the 5 sides who now have 6 home games to get in the fans. It doesn’t look great when the Super Round is poorly attended when it could just have been a normal round and the stadiums would have looked better. I did like how most games were even and each game was kept interesting. I don’t get why Canes v Reds couldn’t end a draw, they are so rare why not accept them.

The Wrap: ‘World’s best provincial rugby competition’ delivers a superb Super Round

Don’t know. depends what it is up against. I think some would have been watching the Connacht v Scarlets game but due to weather (lighting in SA) more may have watched both. Some people only can get the local games on FTA while other will have paid the extra for all the games. Like Leinster v Munster infront of 50k the Bulls v Stormers will be one of the big selling points of the league. In 2019 25,267 showed up for the same game. Last year the game got 41,205. Highest viewed games in the league are Irish and SA games. 21/22 game didn’t make the top 10, 22/23 it didn’t make it either. Top 4 games last season were SA v Irish or Irish v SA games. After the weekend Only 1 SA side sits in the top 8, Stormers are 9th, Lions 11th and Sharks 16th (last). Bulls sit second and it was their first win against the Stormers in the URC.

'Ready to go': Jaguares set for early return to Super Rugby if Rebels fall over

No because without the fees they don’t get a share of the commercial deals. Without the European market the SA teams don’t get the big players back from OS. Yes it was an SA derby but when was the last time the Bulls got 50k for a home game. They could play domestic but SARU doesn’t want to do it just like NZR does want to do domestic only. The sellout is SA fans being in a competition they are engaging in.

'Ready to go': Jaguares set for early return to Super Rugby if Rebels fall over

What’s so good about the NRC. Is RA better spend paying for 5-10 more coaching teamscand support staff who are each not as good as the SRP setups. Is RA better putting their top 100-120 players outside the test selection in worse environments than SR. With the money to run an NRC they would be able to run 5 teams with a squad of 40 each and increase the playing time in SRP by 50%. Look at NPC, one of the better players in the winning side didn’t get a SRP contract so has to wait a year. Bigger squads means they can run a reserves league which is better than an NRC. Easy to add in some SS or HC or vikings to play against the B teams. Better to pay to get more into your better system than pay to create a worse system.

'Our talent is spread too thin': Ex-Wallabies captain urges Rugby Australia to cut Super teams

Yes for three years. It’s cost them alot to move North but the reward is worth it. Bulls v Stormers is sold out and could be their biggest non final attendance. Sometimes change is good but it’s rarely free.

'Ready to go': Jaguares set for early return to Super Rugby if Rebels fall over

It would be funny if it wasn’t true

'Our talent is spread too thin': Ex-Wallabies captain urges Rugby Australia to cut Super teams

Running team v Running team rarely throws up surprises, Running v physicals can go either way so alot more drama. Stormers currently have an 8 game winning run against the Bulls, Stormers have never beaten Munster even though Bulls and Munster’s only difference is the colour of the jersey. But there are slight differences in their physicality which results is completely different results. Or Leinster always beat Toulouse, Toulouse always beat La Rochelle and La Rochelle always beat Leinster. In SRP it seems to be the same teams. Saders will win the big games, Chiefs and Blues will beat Brumbies etc. If you dont face different types of playing style your team is less rounded or what you are good at is harder to use. Brumbies beat up every Oz team but against SA teams they might need to work on their attack.

'Our talent is spread too thin': Ex-Wallabies captain urges Rugby Australia to cut Super teams

The bigger the game the more fans show up. Over the last 10 years how many Semi finals were held in OZ. In Europe you can be in 2 competitions so more teams get to big games and more fans come and stay. I have no doubt if Tahs or Reds had a home semi it would rival the attendance the Blues v Saders final a few years back.

'Our talent is spread too thin': Ex-Wallabies captain urges Rugby Australia to cut Super teams

Italy have Benetton who are probably the second biggest spender of wages outside the T14 (behind Leinster). Zebre can’t do that but because Italy have improved their underage system they are filling up with loads of u25 year olds. The players leave for better teams and the next years under 20s take their place. Zebre are getting better as the better 20 year old becomes a better 24 year old that he replaces. Where are all the u20s from Oz for the last 10 years and how many of them were getting 5-10 games in SR/SRP every season at ages 19, 20 or 21. Oz has a great level of players at 18 when they come out of school and are as good as other places but the lack of professional games between 18-22 means poorer squads in SRP. Miles at the Tahs would have been playing his first year of professional rugby this year but he went abroad and not its his 4th.

'Our talent is spread too thin': Ex-Wallabies captain urges Rugby Australia to cut Super teams

I don’t know why noone at RA or ex-players get that. If SRP became home and away you would have 8 more games which could be started by the 2nd string player at the club, yes you need another 5 players per squad but the academy players and 2nd string get alot more time and become better playing professional games.

'Our talent is spread too thin': Ex-Wallabies captain urges Rugby Australia to cut Super teams

Not sure why you think it will be lower value. If the top 15 Oz players are getting 500k, next 15 450k, next 15 is 400k etc down to the last 15 getting 50k you have 30 players over 5 squads costing $8.25m. Do you think that the players who are 5th best in their position are suddenly going to be a reserve player and get 200 mins a season and get paid a bench players wages, or do you think they will go OS and be a first team player. Is a young starter at the Rebels who wants to make the 2027 WC going to be a bench player at the reds. RA is losing money and needs to cut costs but if RA are only paying a fee to each SRP team then if they divide the fee out to the other 4 teams they have saved nothing and will lose out on broadcast and other comerical deals. You can either cut your top 30 players and save $14.25m or you could cut the bottom 30 and save $2.25m. If you cut the top players they will play OS, if you cut the bottom 30 you are cutting the young and the people who will leave the game. IF you cut the young they will come over using their ancestry to get contracts (kolpac or European players are not limited in the squad), you get Mack Hansen who used his Irish mother to be able to get contact in Ireland, if his mother was English he would have been looking to England. They aren’t going to pick OZ then.

'Our talent is spread too thin': Ex-Wallabies captain urges Rugby Australia to cut Super teams

Steve Hansen wants 4 teams because he thinks all the players in the disbanded team will stay in Oz. The big difference I see between NH and SH club is who owns what. Wasps went to the wall because they took on so much debt and covid stopped their other business so they couldn’t service the debt (kind of like what RA is looking at). Irish went to the wall because they took so long to get their own ground. Worcester went to the wall because wages was 100% of income. If you look at most European clubs they own their stadium or have really good leases (Ospreys being one who doesn’t and have had issues as a result). Owning your stadium or having a big lease means you can make it your own. Having a 5-10k stadium means you can generate a feel good atmosphere. Rebels renting a 30k seater stadium is going to cost alot more than renting a 10k seater stadium.

'Our talent is spread too thin': Ex-Wallabies captain urges Rugby Australia to cut Super teams

As the saying goes he was a hammer looking for a nail and sometimes he found a nail and sometimes he found a baby. Would previous people have got the $8m off NZR. Yes he made stupid decisions but most of the board who were apart of that are all still there. Whose job in RA was it to review the Rebels accounts each year, not Hamish.

'Our talent is spread too thin': Ex-Wallabies captain urges Rugby Australia to cut Super teams

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