Sorry to disappoint Felix, but I’m far from depressed. Sure its a slow day here today, and for me, engaging in a bit of meaningless banter helps pass the time. However I don’t take it too seriously, and I hope that you, and indeed Jerry, don’t do so. I mean its a blog, sometimes spelling mistakes are made, sometimes people even think they know things, but it turns out they don’t….. But its not life defining, or at least it shouldn’t be, and its certainly not something that should be taken to heart.

Veritas nimium altercando amittitur.

Well you figure wrong Jerry. Who’d have thought you could be wrong eh? I didn’t want or need the tip from the likes of you. Nor do I want the shaft. I have no inclination to indulge you in that thanks. You may keep your particular sexual proclivities to yourself and your kind.

And I’m not trying to appear smart Jerry. I expressed an opinion, and made a spelling mistake. You pointed out a spelling error and then felt the necessity to lecture me on the meaning of the misspelt word. One could be forgiven for thinking you were the one trying to appear to be smart. But by all means, please feel free to be the smart one Jerry, if you want to be. It obviously means more to you than it does to me.

Glad to keep you amused Jerry. Small things seem to amuse small minds. Oh, and spare me the “pro” tip. I don’t need such from the likes of you. Its indeed a big call to presume to give someone a “pro tip” when you have no idea as to their professional and/or academic experience isn’t it? Some might call it misguided arrogance.

Sorry to offend your sensibilities Jerry. You are, of course, correct. I misspelled a word. But why the angst over that, little man?

So how far back in the game do you want things to go Chivas? Your argument as to whether the penalty against McMahon was valid or not would have some weight if it was this decision that decided the outcome of the game. It was not. It was the erroneous call from the TMO, and the fact that Walsh abrogated his responsibility to the TMO, and erroneously reversed the penalty that resulted in the Rebels getting the winning points. Whatever happened prior to that incorrect call from the TMO, and the incorrect decision by Walsh to reverse the penalty is moot.

All of the discussion as to who started what in the scuffle between O’Donoghue and Higginbotham is moot. The judiciary clearly found that O’Donoghue did not eye gouge Higginbotham, and Higginbotham himself stated he was not eye gouged. Therefore the penalty should not have been reversed on the heresay of an overzealous (and incorrect) TMO. Ipso facto, Horwill is being fined for telling the truth. Thank you David, for stating the obvious.

Oh I’m sorry PR. I should have realised that “you are used to dealing with” those who don’t share your opinion. Please forgive me, I have a different opinion than you do, and I really can understand that this somehow makes you feel diminished and threatened. You are not alone, there are lots of folks just like you. If it makes you feel better, please pat yourself on the back and consider me “dealt with”. But please refrain from using words such as “go full retard”. They are entirely offensive, and entirely inappropriate.

Here’s another word for you PR. Presumptuous…..look it up, and then go and stand in front of a mirror. And then don’t presume that because you dont know the meaning of a word, that I don’t.

Well Jerry, what more can I say. You were laughing at someones misfortune, or their apparently lowly position. That speaks volumes about you doesn’t it?

And yes, facts would be nice. Not selective facts, just facts will do. The truth does not belong to those that shout the loudest, nor does it belong to those that tell the story. The truth is the plain and simple unadulterated, unadorned truth. You don’t own the truth, nor do I. And it has nothing to do with perception, it has all to do with fact. But I dont expect you to understand this. You will probably be too busy sneering at those less fortunate than you to actually consider anything other than “whoo-hoo my team is better than yours, therefore I’m better than you”. Far be it for me to burst your bubble. Carry on as you were.

Do you feel better now that you’ve vented a little bile Jerry? Some people inhabit sad, bitter and mean-spirited little worlds………Go nuts indeed. Perhaps you’re feeling a bit lonely in the space you inhabit and are in fact exhorting others to join you?

Horwill’s statements were demostrably accurate and correct. Those who pontificate against his “petulant outburst” would do well to consider the facts before subscribing to basically flawed and erroneous, post-modernist judgements.

I’m afraid you seem to miss the point. Are you somehow condoning Berry’s outrageously poor performances because your team has apparently also suffered poor refereeing? I can’t comment on the Sharks Rebels game, as I didnt see it. As a Reds fan, I did however see, for example the Reds v Lions match officiated by Berry, and note that it was not just Reds fans who rated Berry’s performance as atrocious and biased.

On sites such as this there were however numerous comments, mostly from South African supporters, who basically said “well boo hoo, we suffer from this all the time, so suck it up”. I struggle to comprehend this peurile attitude. As long as poor and biased refereeing is tolerated because a particular incidence thereof doesnt directly impinge upon the team you support, then it will continue to spread and proliferate.

This issue is bigger than team, province and country tribalism. It is a blight on the entire game. I trust that you can see that as long as you dont care about it when it impinges upon “Antipodean” teams, that your teams will also continue to suffer from it. Try to be a bigger person for the good of the game, can’t you?

Yes, of course you would think that wouldnt you? In my opinion the article was a poorly written and emotive grab for some controversy. Pray tell, how could any unbiased observer describe a close loss, directly related to a contentious decision, as the Reds “once again caving in”. Talk about drawing the long bow…

AJ I agree that the Reds have been off the pace of late. However i also note that you state quite blithely that the Refs have cost the Reds some games this year, but to highlight that would be papering over the cracks. One wonders how much the Reds poor performances of late are related to the continued run of poor decisions that have gone against them in pivotal moments. It must be pretty demoralising for the playing group to look back at what may have been, if not for poor officiating.

SO you say he is not fastidious or overzealous. I dont know the man, however judging by his actions, fastidious and over-zealous seem to be pretty fair descriptions of the guy. He was the one that pushed extremely hard for a decision that has been proven to be in error. He must have known that the decision he was pushing for would likely influence the outcome of the game, yet he insisted that his view be accepted by the on-field ref. This is contratry to the spirit of the game. And to me, it sounds like someone that has an over-inflated view of their role, or someone who is at somewhat over-zealous.

As a long term Reds fan, I was happy Horwill stood up and said what he said. The Reds have suffered at the hands of some reprehensible refereeing this year. Poor and/or biased refereeing decisions have probably cost them 3 wins, maybe more. And before some genius takes me to task and says the Reds are to blame, and they shouldnt have been in the position to lose games etc save your bile. I’m tired of those that seem to think its alright, as long as its not their team on the wrong end of the decisions. Poor refereeing is not to be condoned nor tolerated.

Yes, the Reds have been playing poorly of late, but one has to ask how much was taken out of the tank by the shockers they were dealt in South Africa. What happened when they came back and played against the Brumbies? Another “extremely contentious (and erroneous)” momentum killing decision goes against them, and a close loss. Then another close loss to the Force. I

I’m the first to admit that the Reds are not playing well this year, and are in part the architects of their own demise. However, if they are such a poor team, how is that the beat the Brumbies in one game, and probably should have beaten them in the second? How is it they were so competitive with the Sharks in SA despite biased refereeing? It seems that of late the team has started to drop their bundle a bit. Poor attitude leads to poor defence, but you cant blame the players for at least feeling a bit hard done by this year. It must be really demoralising for the playing group to have copped some of the decisions they’ve copped this year….

Freddy, your intellectual genius astounds. Keep up the good work champ. I can’t wait for your next insightful gem.

Eye gouging cannot be tolerated. However, in almost every case of eye gouging in rugby, the victim is extremely vociferous and quick to report the incident. Higginbotham made no claim of eye gouging immediately after the incident, and to the best of my knowledge has at no stage post game claimed he was eye gouged.

Surely common sense refereeing would have been to ask the apparent victim, were you eye gouged? Its an extremely serious charge, and if proximity to the eyes is enough to warrant the charge then Higginbotham had his fingers every bit as adjacent to the eyes as did Quirk.

The thing that strikes me is that a couple of seasons ago, how many close games did we see the Graham coached Force lose in the final minutes? Now it seems that this malaise has been transferred to the Reds. Is this coaching, gameplan, game management, the players? All of these perhaps? It just strikes me as strange that the Force were the post child for losing the close games at the last minute, now its the Reds, and one of the common threads is Graham……..

Yes, the scrum has been the achilles heel for a long time now. I am however old enough to remember that famous push over try v Wales at Cardiff Arms Park, and dream of those glory days. It has to come down to coaching. Could Ewen and Topo get together and sort this out, in a coordinated effort with the SR teams?

Look, I realise being a minority on this site may make you feel a bit defensive, however you’ll feel a lot better if you stop manufacturing perceived general slights against you and your countrymen.

For the record, I admire many of the current and past SA players. Matfield, for example has a superb all round game, and I love watching greats of the game, like him, ply their trade, even when they school teams that I support. Habana, in full flight is great to watch. There are many SA players that i admire for their skills, attitude and strength. For goodness sake, I admire many aspects of Bismark Du Plessis’ game, and think he is unfairly maligned in some quarters. He has, in my opinion, potential to be known as one of the greats of the game.

However, I do not think that his long winded and petulant whines to the referee are an example of great captaincy, and I also think that this may backfire on him at some stage in the future (as it did with Gregan towards the ed of his career). In some of his long monologues, he has argued with the referee, and told him “I was told by the ref’s boss I could do that”, in others he has threatened retribution by his team if the ref didnt start to act upon what he (Bismark) thought were the opposition teams indiscretions.

In the post you took umbrage to, I simply stated that Bismarks outbursts to the ref in recent games have been like those of a whining child. I stand by that, but disavow any notion that I’m in some way expressing a dislike of all things South African.

But anyhow BB, I do not mean to get into a slanging match on this topic with you. I usually enjoy reading your posts, you obviously have a great passion for the game, and a good knowledge thereof. Suffice to say that we appear to be at odds on this issue. Good luck tou you and your team for the coming season.

No, I did not say you could not produce a counter argument, I just asked you to put one (a reasonable argument) up. You said you could just as well accuse Australian refs, I asked if you could, in support of your contention, tell me what matches in Australia, refereed by an Australian, and involving a SA team have shown the obvious systematic bias evident in the Reds v Lions match. There may well be examples, however I cannot recall any.

I think you are being a bit precious if you construe anything i’ve said as a general accusation levelled at “every South African official.” I’ve been quite specific in my comments, have never invoked the name of other officials nor made it a larger race based issue. You seem to be the one to do this, in an attempt to defend your country and country men, even though I’m not attacking them.

And as for your contention that “every South African on this website has conceded Berry was unacceptable, not one denied that fact” well that is clearly untrue.

My goodness, what happened to leading by example? Bismark reminds me of a whining child, some of his long winded rants to the referee are almost unprecedented in the sport, and sooner or later he may find that this tactic back fires on him.

You are becoming the poster child for bias, choosing to highlight solely those refereeing decisions that you perceive went against the teams from your home country. You make a compelling case for neutral referees, and an inquiry as to why Berry was chosen to ref the Reds v Lions match, when there was a neutral in the country at the time.

And pray tell what Australian hosted matches involving South African teams have ever seen a 17-4 penalty count against the visiting team, and so many bised decisions as those dished up by Berry in the Reds v Lions game. I suspect you may be able to point to a couple of individual incidents in some games, but never a serious one sided refereeing performance like the second half of that game.