agree, c that’s also the way I saw it. Moved the ball better and I think they also disrupted England’s midfield and game more than Eng theirs. Almost felt like they were the home team getting ready for the big tourno. Were also physically up for it for the whole 90min.

Underwhelming english side for me, guys who didnt play are probably the biggest winners of the night. Their team will look different with Vardy, Kane or Alli in it but I dunno if they have anyone who can drastically change their defense?!

Was impressed by the aussies, Mooy in particular but the bloke should try harder during interviews, omg that was bad!

In any case thats really a great idea to play friendlies against euros, it gives the team a lot of confidence and they sure can match those sides on many aspects of the game.

In my mind CL is better at attacking the line than Foley and he makes his mind faster than Foley too. I have often felt that Phipps and Foley slow the game too much (I mean their decision making process not their speed itself) with the Tahs not really taking advantage of either KB or other backs. Takes ages to launch an attack.

Have to say I may have started on the wrong foot with Foley as I have never seen anything special in him from day 1 (plus I have seen so many reasonably easy kicks missed).

Agree pk, I think McMahon will be in Cheika’s 23 and at some point in the series we will see a McMahon-Hooper-Pocock backrow (could be 20min, a half or game 3 who knows). I actually would love to see that, 3 hyperactive 7s on the field at the same time.

I also want to see Frisby at this level ideally with CL at 10 rather than Foley. Frisby’s pass is imo much crispier than Phipps. Phipps – Foley may be more steady, they are also one of the slowest pair of halves in international rugby. I would love to see a fast paced wallabies side with all those guys together at the same time, even for just 40min.

Hahaha some great posts today PH.

I think Toulon and Boudjellal also deserve a line in your Roar rule book (as evilest evil) whereas good ol’ Jake White has carte blanche to poach as many saffas as he wants, its for the good cause (so its not really poaching is it).

And SH players moving to Europe are just victims of this evil system.

Dean, you’re underestimating europeans resilience to tolerate and even appreciate what you would see as mediocre rugby! That’s a mistake many on here make, they try to understand NH rugby through their SH eyes and apply what works for them.

Northerners have a different relationship with their teams, NT or club: its not ALL about the standard or rugby displayed or their world ranking. A Scotland ranked 12 or 14 would still attract 80k against a FR, Eng, wales etc ranked 10 or 15, and vice versa. Oz ranked 2 doesn’t fill an 80k stadium vs n1 AB or n2-3 Boks, imagine what it would be if Oz were 10 and the kiwis 12. Different sporting culture.

I agree with you that euro clubs love southerners skills and style and they also know their nations do not have the rugby jobs to accommodate them. Offer meets demand, that’s what we are in this situation. But believe me, southerners or not the money is there, clubs just prefer to give 500K to a Conrad Smith than to a not so good euro player, which is understandable.

Southerners could leave tomorrow NH rugby would be fine. Plus don’t forget many NH fans aren’t particularly pleased that SH players are taking locals spots and they know the current situation is detrimental to their nation’s rugby. I grew up in the 80s and 90s with Fr occasionally winning in the SH (kiwis will remember the 1994 series in NZ), now its almost impossible to even get close.

Thats why I don’t want a global calendar nor all those tours, I’d rather have the 2 hemispheres mind their own business and meet at rwc every 4 years. We in the SH can play each other or P.I nations etc, they play their 6N and odd game vs Romania or Georgia. Like in most other sports.

Yeah agree HP. I think its up to the public to let them know how they feel about it and that its not SOO, NFL or BBL territory.

Few weeks ago the FFF organised a pre match ‘show’ before the coupe de la ligue final between PSG and Lille. The artist, Maitre Gims (don’t laugh) got booed big time, it was embarrassing (I actually felt sorry for him). As far as I know there was nothing before this w-e’s cup final.

“Hayne’s diving ankle tap saved Fiji being beaten by France in the quarters. Fiji 12-7 France”

Don’t think you have watched the game David. Fiji won it 40-7 not 12-7 and Hayne’s tackle prevented a certain ‘consolation’ try for the French nothing more (Fiji were 25 or 30 pts up with a couple of min to go if I remember well). He coughed up the ball straight after that.

We all want Hayne to do well but lets be honest Fiji 7 are better without him. The only thing he may bring to the team is his experience of big games and the fact he can play a more structured brand of rugby than his team mates. But is it what Fiji should do? I know if I had 10-12 natural footballers like Fijians are I would not tame and ‘westernise’ them.

I think many aussies still have a mental block about ‘friendlies” as they are used to their beloved ‘test matches’ in other sports. In football, friendlies are often played just before a major comp and coaches use them to fine tune the squad, try new combo, give a bit of game time to players in different positions or who are just back from injuries etc. They are useful!! that’s why they keep playing them! Then its up to the coach himself to treat the game as an exhibition (I think oz guys think exhibition equals friendly) but they rarely don’t unless it is an exhibition match.

England wont do absolutely everything to win this one but I still think Hodgson and his guys will learn from it so its not a nothing game. Euro teams usually don’t like to play each other before the comp but with 24 qualified this year its not easy to get a decent euro opponent, that’s why Oz for England is imo a pretty decent one as socceroos share euro teams athleticism. For the record Italy will play Finland while france will play Cameroon and Scotland.

The socceroos who don’t have a major comp starting next month are more in sparring partner mode but I still think Ange is clever enough to use this game to help answer a couple of questions he may have or just see some guys. Then he probably wishes supporters back home would understand better they sometimes have to play this kind of games to get ready for d day but there is still a fair bit of work to do to achieve this and eradicate the “me, I don’t like friendlies”! No one loves friendlies, but they are still part of football.

Agree harry. Biting has never been welcome in French rugby although, paradoxically, ‘sucking’ has, especially during well celebrated third halves. How funny!

My childhood/teen age hero Mike Tyson being the world most famous biter I have tried to understand what’s behind the act of biting and I have to say I haven’t come up with a satisfactory answer. Very low act (and quite puzzling! I get the stomping, head-butting etc but biting?)

No worries red. I think 3 qf in nz would have been a fair reflection of the season. Then up to the saffa or aussie team to win it on kiwi soil.

I am with those kiwi fans RandB. If you want to have a credible comb quality should be rewarded not penalised. If the 4 best team of the comp are from nz they should all be in the semis. Super rugby is a championship, not a cup. In cup format competitions a good or bad draw is important and thats ok.

But championships are different, the best teams rise to the top week after week and you dont need to be a genius to see that this year the best teams are in your country.

I actually think aussie and saffa fans can be ‘educated’ (the good ones) and appreciate that their teams are weaker than nz ones and thats fair enough, and that they can still enjoy the last 2 rounds of the comp. I am sure many would stay interested even without their teams in the semis. Was at the pub to watch lander v saders, some aussiez non rugby fans got stuck and watched the whole game. When they saw the next one was an aussie derby they left. Would be curious to know tv audiences in oz for nz derbies vs aussie ones. I support the tahs, and as much as I would love to see a sf here in sydney I would shake my head if we had to host the chiefs, saders or landers.

Thats a bit of a silly article. If you ‘constantly underachieve’ it just means you’re an average team or at least ‘not that good’.

In comparison to the relative success of their clubs on the euro stage yes england NT hasn’t been successful but saying they should have been winning trophies is plain silly. Most other NT had players in the epl helping english clubs win those trophies, its only logical those nations do better than england on the international stage.

Most english players, fans and coaches know that. The only ones i have heard say that england have underachieved are often aussies who dont know much about football.

Kpm its not only about the last 2 teams. Sanzar has been diluting their product for years. Let me take an example.

Moved here permanently in 2003, tahs season ticket holder straight away, super 12 years, all big games. For ‘very’ big games I.e reds derby or spencer’s blues, matfield/botha bulls, semi finals etc my gf and colleagues from oz, europe or even yanks would join. Thats why we got 28k crowds for ‘normal’ yet big games and 35k for even bigger ones. Those were the years when the highlanders or sharks games were seen as smallish.

Then we started adding cheetahs, lions, rebels, force and now jaguares and wolves. I am fine with that but for most aussie punters/ casual rugby fans those teams arent exciting. Look at the roar, most ppl have been asking for the lions to be axed fpr years, same with the force! For many aussies the sr franchises which were added to the ‘historical 12’ are not exciting to watch on tv or live at the game. So we are not talking 1 game a season but potentially 6 teams which are seen, wrongly I agree, as weak or not attractive. Thats why imo ppl started losing interest.

Wrong pricing strategies and other errors are also imo valid reasons.

Agree with many of your points kpm but disagree with the main one: its not only affecting one game per year its snowballing and impacting other ganes too.

Ppl are creatures of habit, if you dont go to the stadium for 1 or 2 games out of 7 or dont watch on tv you end up not turning up for the biggies too. Thats what we are seeing in oz both on tv and in stadiums. Tahs v reds or v bulls used to be big near sellout games. No longer the case and from what am seeing in SA its the same. Loftus used to be near capacity, where are they now?

Anyway its a tough ine to resolve and i hope sanzaar do their best.

Point taken pk 😉

I hope you are right kpm as I do want sh rugby to keep their best rugby players.Am just not sure expanding into non rugby markets is the way to go, or at least not blindly. Are our sa, nz, and oz franchises much richer now with J and argie money than they were before? We may get more tv money from those counties but we lose at the gate and in our own tv market. And we also lose to other sports on our own market.

If aussies love watching parra v manly, hawthorn v collingwood or west syd vs syd fc in league, afl and football why would they prefer watching sydney v joburg or miami in rugby? Are we that different? Same for players, I dont think kb was as gutted as peats was this week cause playing for your preferred club no longer matters in rugby.

But if sanzaar thinks linking with the yanks, canadians, hk etc is the solution lets do this.

Am absolutely sure its working in NZ RaB. Not so much in oz or elsewhere. The crowds have been very average in the 2 biggest oz SR cities (Bris and Syd used to get 30k 10 years ago, we are between 15-20k now) and the tv audiences are now laughable. The ppl I knew who were into SR are now casual fans, watch the odd game etc. SR is no longer their/our staple sport. Maybe its just us but from what I am hearing we aren’t the only ones.

From what I see on tv (and looking at the accelerating exodus of their players) SA is not doing better now than they were a few years ago. Plenty of empty seats, who watch SA rugby live on tv outside SA? Not many in oz or japan.

Not sure about that harry, if rugby or sports in general was all about ‘weather’ and ‘interesting places to play” all major comps would take place in sunny brasil, SA, Oz, Miami etc. Hamilton, Dunedin or Christchurch are probably (in your eyes or those of ppl who value weather and big flashy cities) not exciting yet they are hosting the rugby people want to watch, not only at the stadium but also on tv.

Give me Hamilton or Dunedin over Las Vegas, Rio or HK any day of the week. Re SR expansion I think the solution was on our doorstep right here with the P.I. Last w-e we had a league Samoa v Tonga in Sydney’s west (you would not like it there its not as flashy as Sydney’s east or cape town I guess, it’s our Sydney’s Ulster ;). Same time you had Tahs v Cheetahs, well the good ppl of oz and Sydney in particular chose to watch the foreigners over their locals and I sure did too. Relevance and having a meaningful comp still matter Harry. I am absolutely certain that a waratahs vs PI franchise in SR would attract more ppl than any saffa team here, or the J and argie franchises. Yet we decided to look elsewhere.

I actually find it paradoxical that people are calling for expansion on ever more continents ( its still possible we are ‘only’ on 4) while everyone agree that the best rugby they have watched is from the smallest towns of the smallest country in SR (yes that’s NZ). As I have said to pk before am not against expansion to the US, HK etc per se, am just not sure its what ppl really want. Plus we are losing Islanders rugby players and many more ‘traditional’ fans who still want to understand the comp before they watch it.

Dunno what the rules are re June tour: this week i read Clermont coach say he had no choice but to release Davies (welsh) and Cudmore (Canada) for the June tour.

On the other hand I know none of the top 14 finalists will release their French players for the argentina tour. I think if Cheika picks QC, Mitchell and co they’ll have to go? Hope he plays hardball and picks them just before the finals.

Yep hope you’re right pk. Imo, paradoxically, rugby’s only chance is to NOT develop too much. Its still not that big in europe, usa, asia etc and I hope it stays like this.

what makes rugby a potential nightmare and mess at international level is that smaller nations (p.i, nz, sa and even oz) are the dominant countries and are all very far away from the usual big sporting markets. Thats what destabilize the rugby world imo. Its a unique situation.

A pity really. I for once thought Spiro was balanced and spot on. Seems its ok to have a politicised rwc but not to talk about it.

bto, the thing I didn’t get nor like in this article is that the author on one hand says that there are many ways to win (agree 100%) but then dismisses Ranieri’s style and call it ‘ugly’. Leicester may have a more direct style of football it doesn’t make it ugly in my book.

I have never been a fan of teams who base everything on possession and need 50-60 passes in the midfield to launch an attack. I know many loved the tiki taka barca or spain used to play, i didn’t. Again I have no problem with ppl preferring this style but pls don’t call anything that’s different ‘ugly’. Kante is a superb player and I loved watching him disrupt those teams who loved possession and wanted to make him/leicester run. Well he sure did (run) and wasn’t too bad at it! Quality or what’s entertaining or not is in the eye of the beholder.

“Which bit don’t you understand?”

My main issue is with the “Could Optus be the reason Australians stop loving football?”. Am early 40s and, like billions of other fans in the world I have not always had access to the epl in my life. Never stopped me from watching football. Do basketball aussie fans need the nba to love their sport?

I completely understand that fans would/will be disappointed if they don’t have access to the epl, ucl etc from next year (i would) but ‘stop loving football’ is the bit I don’t get. As I said, that’s an ‘only is oz’ (well maybe new world?) moment. Ask an Italian, Mexican or Japanese football fan if he may stop watching football if he doesn’t get his 2-3 epl games fix and he will think you’re mad (and he’ll be right).

Benzema is out, Valbuena won’t make it either it seems (on form alone, he isn’t banned), Sacko won’t probably be considered (doping ) and its too little too late for Ribery who had recently made himself ‘available’ despite retiring a couple of years ago.

Plenty of quality in the midfield and wings but no world class 9 and a fairly weak defence. Griezman may play 9 if Deschamps chooses to have Payet and Ben Arfa in the starting 11 but it seems unlikely.

I think lloris- sagna,evra, kosczielny,varane- matuidi, kante(cabaye), pogba,payet- griezman, and either gignac/giroud/martial/coman at 9.

Rick, how can you say that without even knowing the 20 teams’ rosters for 16-17? Based on Leicester’s name alone?