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Sean Fagan is a long-retired rugby hooker (Smithfield Warthogs RFC) and now author/journalist specialising in the early history of the rugby codes. He has written extensively for major newspapers, magazines, websites and released a number of books, the most recent ‘The First Lions of Rugby’, the story of the 1888 British Lions rugby and Aussie rules playing tour of Australia. sfaganweb.com
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From the distance of 100 years since the start of World War One it is difficult for us today to fully appreciate why men,…
'Electorate football' sounds like a euphemism for the humbugging of us by vote-seeking politicians; instead it is the scheme that gave birth to the…
Full time footballers aren't a new phenomenon; the first were those in touring teams of the 1880s. Did they unleash on the public scandals…
The great bugbears of rugby are penalty goals and the whim of a referee. Is that fair criticism, or is it simply the nature…
The most impressive aspect of the Lions victory over the stoic Waratahs was the manner of their five tries – all came through deft…
A party from the British and Irish Lions yesterday visited Maitland and the grave of 1888 Lions captain Bob Seddon. The Hunter region is…
Though never the home side, the British and Irish Lions take the field backed by a ‘sea of red' fans. Football team nicknames and…
The British and Irish Lions are here, it's State of Origin time, the Socceroos face Japan, our cricketers are in England – should AFL…
The scrum in the NRL has long descended into two adjacent huddles engaged in a stop-work meeting. It is a farce and charade that…
Tomorrow night’s Reds-Waratahs game celebrates 130 years since these two now long-time rivals first met on Queensland soil, a match equably notable for being…
Correction (2nd last line): “you can invent” should be “you can’t invent”.
Longmire loves Origin - just not in AFL
@ Australian Rules. RL didn’t copy anything except the WAFL instituted phrase of the late 1970s for its one-off games it called “State of Origin”. There was no annual inter-state Aust rules series in the late 1970s. The Blues & Maroons had been playing each other in an annual RL 3-game series since 1908, and that was built on an annual RU series going back to 1882. It was only in the late 1970s in Sydney (not Brisbane) that crowds began to fall away from what in the 50s & 60s had often topped 50K. The concept of picking teams on the basis of qualification instead of residency was in rugby back to the start of the Home Nations in the 1880s, soccer’s world cup in the 1930s, Wales in RL since the 1950s & the Kiwis before Origin even began. You are right – you can invent a means to engage with fans – Origin would not exist if it wasn’t built on the history of NSW vs QLD going back to 1882.
Longmire loves Origin - just not in AFL
Cheers Crashy. Go to http://Lions1888.com – follow the info/link there for a 25% discount & free postage anywhere in Aust.
Lions' sea of red, white and blue
@ The Pivotonian. There is a photo of the two teams from this match in The First Lions of Rugby. The Lions wore red, white & blue rugby jerseys (long sleeve). Sth Melb had their traditional red & white hoops, most appeared sleeveless.
Lions' sea of red, white and blue
@ Dale. Where is the example of my anti-rugby sentiment? Me bringing into light events from past decades or century that don’t paint RU admin or actions favourably doesn’t make me anti-rugby – it is the events themselves & the actions of people in the past, not me writing about them. A shot at RU admin (as we see day to day here on the Roar!) does not make one anti-rugby the game, nor is writing about RL mean one is automatically anti RU (Jack Pollard & Max Howell two examples). I played the game for 15 years & I’ve been running sites such as http://jottingsonrugby.com/ for over a decade. But, I agree, there are some that have pigeon-holed me long ago! 🙂
Lions' sea of red, white and blue
@ PGNEWC. I don’t disagree that the Waratah moniker was ramped up when the Super Rugby went pro in 1995. However, a search on newspaper archives such as Sydney Morning Herald turned up use of Waratahs in pre and post match reports from the late 1980s onwards. The NSW rugby team had not been referred to as Blues in newspapers since 1920s.
Lions' sea of red, white and blue
@ Rob9. Yes there was that drawn game. There have been 5 (I think) instances of a Lions team playing in the UK, including the 1888 tourists.playing against Swinton when they returned to the UK. Most of the 5 weren’t recognised as international games. Perhaps I ought to have replaced ‘never’ with ‘rarely’, but in 125 years of Lions history, home games are less frequent than even the word ‘rarely’ conveys.
Lions' sea of red, white and blue
@ The Sheriff. http://sfaganweb.wordpress.com/the-rugby-rebellion/
SPIRO'S Lions Diary: A terrific book to kick-start the Lions tour
@ Australian Rules – I was speculating that in time the $ earned by rugby & soccer in Australia from involvement in international tournaments & touring teams would exceed that made domestically by AFL or NRL. The scenarios painted by Wilson Flatley are also distinctly possible too.
Lions Tour, Origin or club footy?
@ Australian Rules. The final line of the article was more to do with pondering how AFL & NRL would fare if the global competitions began to bring more money to soccer, cricket and rugby than the domestic sources could provide to AFL & NRL.
Lions Tour, Origin or club footy?
@ Chairman Kaga – you claimed the Victorian rugby union is actually the oldest rugby competition in Australia. It did not start up again in 1930. It never stopped!. You are in error. It plays for an older cup (Dewar Shield 1909), but the Sydney club comp (est 1900) is older (Shute Shield 1923). The Melb club comp has not been continuous. Putting aside war years, the Melb RU club comp did not exist 1919-1925. That club’s history page in the link above is not without error.
Lions Tour, Origin or club footy?
The Argus 12 April 1926 page 17
In the first practice game of the season Melbourne Rugby Club beat Kiwis by 8-6 at Middle Park on Saturday afternoon. Great keenness was shown in the Union code which has been adopted this year in favour of the League game.
The Argus 27 April 1926 page 17
In the annual report of the NZRU it is stated that towards the end of last season the union was advised by Mr Geddis that there was a favourable opportunity to establish the game in Melbourne. Shortly afterwards the union had received a letter rom the Victorian Rugby League in which the league expressed a desire to disband and transfer to the rugby union
Lions Tour, Origin or club footy?
@ Chairman Kaga. The VRU competition was ended due to WW1. Nothing was done to revive “rugby” in Melbourne until an amateur RL competition was established in Melb in 1923-25, after which the clubs voted to end affiliation with RL and re-form as the VRU. By all means if you still question the validity of that check the Melb newspapers http://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper or Jack Pollard’s history of rugby in Australia.
Lions Tour, Origin or club footy?
@ Timmuh – you’re right, and the choices really have become far more available over the past 20 years with the change in media delivery & tv sport availability. Steve Mortimer predicts we will all adopt the “Wagga Wagga principle” of supporting…not tied to one code alone, we will have a favourite team in every code. Is “bandwagon” another name for that?
Lions Tour, Origin or club footy?
@ Titus. I think it is fair to say that whatever “football” game Melbourne adopted it would have supported it & the clubs just as enthusiastically and vociferously as it has done with Aust rules. The city’s support & attendance for horse racing & cricket would indicate that.
Lions Tour, Origin or club footy?
@ BigAl. I agree, just not sure how one can assess the decision as “correct” or wrong – a successful Lions v Victoria game or series in 1888 may have perhaps encouraged NSW (using its best “footballers” of either code) & Victoria to meet in a series in 1889 in Melbourne & Sydney using Aust rules or hybrid rules, leading to one national Australian football code & no other codes.
Lions Tour, Origin or club footy?
@ hutch. It was in reference to the loss of international games that formerly were played during the Australian domestic season. While RL still has the 3-game interstate series, it no longer has in-season Test match series and other internationals (eg state teams vs international teams). The attendances & tv ratings in the Lions & Kiwis visits in the late 1980s to mid 1990s were comparable to Origin. A Sydney RL season in the late 1980s would have had most if not all of a pre season cup, 7s tournament, mid week Cup, Origin series, Test match series. Now the NRL is just a few seasons of NSW Blues domination away from being as barren as a AFL season when it comes to offering something different. Rugby & soccer have bucketloads of options.
Lions Tour, Origin or club footy?
No reason the RFL or NZRL couldn’t be the drivers behind reform. The NRL is supposed to be subservient to the RLIF when it comes to adopting rule changes to rugby league.
Rugby league scrums must innovate or perish
I think that is why a few days work-shopping various formations & options is worth pursuing. Try ’em all & see what eventuates. To do nothing but remain inert in the face of the current scrum system’s failings won’t provide any solutions, that’s for sure.
Rugby league scrums must innovate or perish
Boz. The NSWRL tried that in the 1920s. It failed for the reason in your last sentence.
Rugby league scrums must innovate or perish
Referees tend to call back or penalise anything unexpected. It stifles innovation. Think I can recall two instances of a pack breaking up in a way for their half back to run straight thru what was the middle of the scrum, and bolted away for a try, but both times the on-field ref dumped it off to the video ref, who found a means to rule against it (obstruction).
Rugby league scrums must innovate or perish
Well said. Hence the need to trial & workshop – who knows what it could deliver. We sure as heck know what not doing anything will deliver!
Rugby league scrums must innovate or perish
A similar argument came in the late 1880s over scrums when the first British Lions toured NZ & Australia http://Lions1888.com . They brought hooking & heeling-back with them. Here in the colonies that was viewed as (and by the book was) unlawful – as the ball came back progressively thru the scrum, in turn each forward was thus in front of the ball & off-side. It was only later that the laws caught up to sanction that a player is not off-side in the scrum if still bound. Even earlier it was argued that if you pass the ball back, say to your right, and a defender is coming at you from your left, the moment you pass the ball you are illegally obstructing the defender.
The above isn’t an argument in favour or against the issues of the modern maul, but does serve to illustrate that the law book has not always been applied in black & white. It gets into that difficult to pin area of “the spirit of the game”.
It is worth examining though, for what is allowed to happen today, whether by the laws or by convention (ignoring the strict reading of the laws), will lead to the next evolution of tomorrow…and we may not like what that may be.
Inconsistency of the law relating to the maul
If a contest for the ball is to be had, and some semblance of order be given to the contest, you can see why the scrum evolved the way it did. It was, when the players and officials were committed to it, an ordered & ‘neat’ way to compete for possession. What are the alternatives? AFL’s umpire bouncing or tossing the ball. The throw-in from touch as in soccer & RU. RL either admits there is no contest & just makes it a hand-over, or must re-think the scrum…this in-between place the game/scrums is in at the moment is too comical and unprofessional to remain.
Rugby league scrums must innovate or perish
Cheers Sheek. Interesting comparing the QLD team jersey vs Lions from 2001 design to 2013 design – they are almost identical (all white with coloured shoulder saddle), but the maroon of 2001 is now gone & tomorrow is distinctly red. I suspect QLD adopted maroon in the mid 1890s as it was close as you could get to purple, which was the recognised traditional colour of royalty (being Queen’s Land) – whatever its origin, its use in the RU team established maroon as the Queensland state colour, which is something the QRU should be boastful & proud of, but now, as you illustrated in your example, that is all forgotten &/or passed on to the league Maroons.
Lions' sea of red, white and blue