The Swans and Buddy: A match made in heaven

Stephen Roar Rookie

By Stephen, Stephen is a Roar Rookie

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    Lance Franklin’s first four years at the Sydney Swans have been quite remarkable. On the surface, he has played 89 games, kicked 280 goals, played two grand finals, been selected three times as an All Australian and won two Coleman Medals.

    However, the impact Franklin has had commercially on his second AFL club is arguably even more impressive than his on-field feats. Following Sydney’s 2012 premiership, membership for season 2013 reached a record high of around 36,000. Following Franklin’s recruitment at the end of season 2013, Sydney’s membership has grown exponentially to around 59,000 for season 2017.

    That is 64 per cent growth in the four years since Franklin arrived in Sydney, and for a club over 100 years old (including their days in South Melbourne).

    Without surveying the new members, it’s difficult to understand how much of the 64 per cent growth in membership is attributable to Franklin’s arrival. I’m tipping it’s significant, but I cannot prove it.

    So what else has occurred during Franklin’s time in Sydney to drive such extraordinary growth? I can only see two major developments of note.

    Firstly, the Swans’ unpopular contract with ANZ Stadium was terminated a year early, allowing the club to play all home games at the SCG from Round 1, 2016, no doubt providing a positive for club membership.

    Secondly, the Giants were introduced officially to the AFL in 2012. Remember all those dire warnings about how the city of Sydney would be unable to support two AFL clubs? Well, since those warnings, total membership in city Sydney has grown from around about 27,000 in 2011 (Swans only) to 80,000 for season 2017 (Swans 59k and GWS 21k) – almost 200 per cent growth in six years!

    Phil Davis GWS Giants Lance Franklin Sydney Swans AFL 2016

    (AAP Image/Dan Himbrechts)

    GWS has arguably increased demand in Sydney for local AFL memberships via the growing cross-town rivalry and increased marketing overall. As previously stated, this growth is opposed to the many dire warnings to the contrary. Franklin’s simultaneous arrival in Sydney also appears a key factor in the membership resurgence in Australia’s toughest AFL market.

    If there is a hint of truth to the original argument that GWS’s growth must come at the Swan’s expense, it only makes Franklin’s impact even more remarkable.

    Finally, club membership is more valuable today than ever before. The income stream of membership revenue flows steadily through the year. Major sponsors are attracted to a club database boasting tens of thousands of growing, loyal and engaged members. Online advertising income is improved with greater member engagement. Merchandise sales have been proven to increase. And once captured, clubs can up-sell members into improved seating, interstate games, hospitality and more.

    Members are the lifeblood of any club’s long-term sustainability. Lance Franklin’s legacy and impact on Sydney’s membership will be enjoyed by the Swans for many years to come. Not to mention sponsorship, match attendances, merchandise sales, and television ratings.

    Some commentators have argued the success of Franklin’s nine-year contract with the Swans hinges on him becoming a premiership player at Sydney. Try selling that argument to senior management at the club as they study the financial impact of Franklin’s tenure. It’s a simplistic argument.

    In so many ways, he’s a Buddy marvel.

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    The Crowd Says (121)

    • November 20th 2017 @ 9:03am
      Roger of Sydney said | November 20th 2017 @ 9:03am | ! Report

      Could not agree more, the AFL is growing at the grass root level in NSW, I was laughed at 20 years ago by blokes who now come to footy with me and drink Coopers. Happy days

    • November 20th 2017 @ 9:08am
      Gyfox said | November 20th 2017 @ 9:08am | ! Report

      onward & upward!

    • Roar Guru

      November 20th 2017 @ 9:15am
      mds1970 said | November 20th 2017 @ 9:15am | ! Report

      Unlike in Queensland, where the Suns without doubt have cannibalised the Lions support, that hasn’t happened in Sydney. When the Giants were introduced, the Swans’ membership went up. You can’t say that the Swans have suffered in any way due to the coming of the Giants.
      Footy in Sydney has grown enormously in recent years, and that’s good for the game. Buddy has played a role in that – it’s a very expensive contract, and there’s still five years to run on it. And unfortunately for him he had a shocker in the 2014 Grand Final. But there’s no doubt he’s a popular marketing figure and gets bums on seats.

      • November 20th 2017 @ 9:58am
        Birdman said | November 20th 2017 @ 9:58am | ! Report

        In fairness Buddy was one of better Swans players in the 2014 granny which is not saying a lot in the context of that particular team effort.

        I wonder if the Swans (and now the Giants) weren’t in contention whether the metrics in this article wouldn’t be so rosey for NSW AFL.

        The reality is Buddy has helped keep the Swans in contention but hasn’t got them over the line (not his fault IMO) – if they were a low to middle table proposition I’d doubt if the payoff on the Buddy deal would have been so clearly positive.

        If someone has been let down by this deal (to date), it’s Buddy who would have fully expected to add premierships to the 2 he won with Hawthorn.

      • Roar Guru

        November 20th 2017 @ 11:44am
        Cat said | November 20th 2017 @ 11:44am | ! Report

        Much easier to hang onto your fans when your side is successful. The Lions were bleeding fans and making mistakes before the Suns showed up. The Suns just accelerated what was happening. Combine years of poor performance, the paddle pop logo disaster, recruiting mistakes (Fevola) and the hype that the Suns and GWS were going to be the new super teams and win the next 27 flags, is it any surprise at all that Brisbane lost more fans?

      • November 20th 2017 @ 12:30pm
        Stephen said | November 20th 2017 @ 12:30pm | ! Report

        Mds1970, the numbers in Queensland would largely support your argument. In 2010, total AFL Queensland membership was around 29,000 (Lions only). In 2011 – the Suns first official season – the Lions dropped to 21,000 and the Suns secured 14,000 members. That is still 21% growth overall. Season 2017 membership sees the Lions flat at 21,000 and the Suns down to around 12,000.

        So, not a lot of overall growth in AFL Queensland. And perhaps the Suns growth has been at Brisbane’s expense.

      • November 21st 2017 @ 3:44pm
        Rob said | November 21st 2017 @ 3:44pm | ! Report

        No GC hasnt taken many of Brissys supporters. People from GC dont go to Brisbane and vice versa. Brisbanes supporters are out enjoying the sun and awsome weather cause theres so much to do in and around Brisbane without giving up a chunk of your hard earned money and weekend to watch your team get smashed.

        I know – i live in Perth and barrack for Melbourne.

    • November 20th 2017 @ 10:01am
      Hungry Jack said | November 20th 2017 @ 10:01am | ! Report

      Sensible and logical article, Stephen. The Buddy knockers should take all this into account before calling Sydney’s deal with him a failure on the grounds of no premierships. There’s still time! And he’s a part of the reason we keep putting ourselves in contention along with all the other members of our ‘machine’. Go Bloods!

      • November 20th 2017 @ 11:14am
        Birdman said | November 20th 2017 @ 11:14am | ! Report

        haha – he’s still an amazing player but will never be better than when he played in brown and gold.

      • Roar Guru

        November 20th 2017 @ 11:46am
        Cat said | November 20th 2017 @ 11:46am | ! Report

        Could also argue that Buddy’s huge contract is what prevented the Swans from being able to hold onto/get those one or two missing pieces to push them that extra step.

        • November 20th 2017 @ 12:07pm
          GJ said | November 20th 2017 @ 12:07pm | ! Report

          Yep – it could have been Tippett. Or a combination of both.

          • November 20th 2017 @ 12:45pm
            Stephen said | November 20th 2017 @ 12:45pm | ! Report

            Agree GJ. Franklin’s first four years have been a huge success – in every way possible – with the exception of a premiership. Tippett on the other hand – has been an expensive exercise – with questionable benefits.

        • November 20th 2017 @ 12:23pm
          Slane said | November 20th 2017 @ 12:23pm | ! Report

          I don’t even know that they have any missing pieces. They have a great list and it’s hard to see them not snagging a flag.

          • November 20th 2017 @ 12:55pm
            Stephen said | November 20th 2017 @ 12:55pm | ! Report

            Slane, the Swans have made 11 of the last 12 finals series. So they tend to be an automatic prediction for the top eight each year. Wether the current list – with the aging demographic – can make finals again in 2018 – I’m not convinced.

            • November 20th 2017 @ 2:02pm
              Harsh Truth Harry said | November 20th 2017 @ 2:02pm | ! Report

              Slane doesn’t get the harsh truth…of course the Swans make finals…Longmire trains them to win on their tiny ground…then each year they get belted eventually at the MCG…becasue…it is wide and the Swans are slow…how can people not see that easy harry truth????

              • Roar Guru

                November 20th 2017 @ 3:15pm
                Cat said | November 20th 2017 @ 3:15pm | ! Report

                Must be why they slaughtered Essendon, lack of speed. Or maybe there is more to the game than just speed. Still need skill and heart, something Essendon lacks.

              • November 20th 2017 @ 3:21pm
                Harsh Truth Harry said | November 20th 2017 @ 3:21pm | ! Report

                Cat, where was the final played between Ess v Syd? Oh yes the toy ground Longmire trains them for…the G finds them out every year! Even your slow old team made them look one paced! Cat we had just emerged from the awful AFL persecution of our great club…all we needed was to make one final which Woosha got us….the seed is set the flag in 2018 is now ours for the taking! So much envy I guess because of the Cats lowly 9 flags…

              • Roar Guru

                November 20th 2017 @ 4:47pm
                Cat said | November 20th 2017 @ 4:47pm | ! Report

                You mean the self infliction, should have been punished a whole hell of a lot more era?

                I do not care about VFL flags. I do not care how many your club BOUGHT. You cannot compare players from different eras – so how do you expect to compare flags from different eras? It boggles the mind that people like you are that delusional.
                Since the field has been far more level your club has stunk. So much so your club intentionally set out to che@t and dope their own players like lab rats.

              • November 20th 2017 @ 5:44pm
                Hungry Jack said | November 20th 2017 @ 5:44pm | ! Report

                Wow Harry! MCG is a whole 5 metres wider than the SCG and c.10m longer. Not too different! Any excuse though! No doubt you’ll use it again when the Swans and Cats pump your ordinary lot!

              • Roar Guru

                November 21st 2017 @ 7:43am
                Redb said | November 21st 2017 @ 7:43am | ! Report


                Move on dolt.

                Essendon sure has. $5M profit, growing membership. A few on here thought the supplements debacle would kill the club.

                Go Bombers.

              • November 21st 2017 @ 3:47pm
                Rob said | November 21st 2017 @ 3:47pm | ! Report

                Probably still distracted by that flag they won on the MCG in 2012…

        • November 20th 2017 @ 2:15pm
          Mattyb said | November 20th 2017 @ 2:15pm | ! Report

          The Swans have unfortunately been unable to secure a premiership in Franklins time but what are the missing pieces? They’ve competed in multiple GFs and make finals every year. It also needs to be remembered they have contested two GFs as the away side despite finishing higher on the ladder than their opponent,an enormous disadvantage.
          Franklin has been an excellent player for Sydney and is arguably the best player in the competition.

          • Roar Guru

            November 20th 2017 @ 3:21pm
            Cat said | November 20th 2017 @ 3:21pm | ! Report

            It needs to be remembered (what a ridiculous turn of phrase btw) that Sydney didn’t seem to have a problem winning at the MCG prior to signing Buddy. The ground didn’t suddenly change. The effect it has or doesn’t have hasn’t changed. The only thing that has changed is the Swans. They used to be very balanced and team oriented. Now they have a few stars (one which can’t stay on the park) and an over reliance on one which makes them far more predictable. Longmire is fast becoming known as a one trick pony. If a team schemes against what the Swans do best (get buddy the ball) they have no answer.

            • November 20th 2017 @ 5:01pm
              Mattyb said | November 20th 2017 @ 5:01pm | ! Report

              It’s certainly not impossible for Australian clubs outside the VFL to win the premiership away despite ladder finishes but the disadvantages are enormous. You’ll find during the home and away season and even the minor finals that many people base their weekly tips around who the home side is on any given week,which is a fair indication I believe.

              • Roar Guru

                November 20th 2017 @ 5:54pm
                Cat said | November 20th 2017 @ 5:54pm | ! Report

                I think a fair indication is the exact 50/50 split of GF’s played between one Victorian team and one interstate side. Shows it makes no difference at all. The better team on the day wins. Everything else is just an excuse.

              • November 20th 2017 @ 7:09pm
                Mattyb said | November 20th 2017 @ 7:09pm | ! Report

                Like I said,it’s not impossible for an Australian club outside the VFL to win the premiership just far harder.
                I’m pretty sure Franklin would have won a premiership at Sydney if not for the unreasonable and Victorian centric nature of the championship decider.

              • Roar Guru

                November 20th 2017 @ 8:38pm
                Cat said | November 20th 2017 @ 8:38pm | ! Report

                I’m pretty sure Sydney woulda stunk up whatever ground they played at that day. Just not good enough. The ground did not lose them the game.

      • November 20th 2017 @ 1:11pm
        Harsh Truth Harry said | November 20th 2017 @ 1:11pm | ! Report

        There is not time….the Swans are gone…they make finals because of their silly little toy SCG but fail each final series becasue a lack of pace on the wide expanses of the G, Geelong exactly the same and theres another club put everything behind one bloke….both perennial finalists past 5 years, both finals flops….too old, too slow.

        • November 20th 2017 @ 1:56pm
          Hungry Jack said | November 20th 2017 @ 1:56pm | ! Report

          Yeah, yeah, yeah. Broken record. No substance. Ignorant of many of the new Young Bloods to have gained experience over the last few years. Got anything else to hang your hat on, Harry?

        • Roar Guru

          November 20th 2017 @ 3:16pm
          Cat said | November 20th 2017 @ 3:16pm | ! Report

          Speaking of finals flops … Essendon have the longest finals winless streak in the entire AFL.

        • November 21st 2017 @ 8:32am
          Rod said | November 21st 2017 @ 8:32am | ! Report

          Smaller but there doesn’t seem to be too much difference in ground dimensions. And Sydney were able to beat Richmond and Melbourne on the MCG this year.

          MCG Field size 160 metres x 141 metres (

          SCG field size: 151.5m x 136m (

      • Roar Guru

        November 20th 2017 @ 5:30pm
        Penster said | November 20th 2017 @ 5:30pm | ! Report

        Buddy has been a huge success for the Swans, on and off field. He was and is a spectacular team player, was one of their (few) good players in the 2014 GF and played injured in 2015 GF. The team let themselves down on both occasions, and sure there’s still time to win a flag, but it is a very long time for a premiership window to remain open. Great club tho, high attendance, passionate supporters, membership sales, clever CEO in Andrew Ireland with Tom Harley (how’d Geelong let him slip away?) in the wings “culture” around youngsters and families strong, academy etc. And every September when they look the goods, I pencil them in for a premiership ………….

    • November 20th 2017 @ 1:08pm
      Harsh Truth Harry said | November 20th 2017 @ 1:08pm | ! Report

      The Buddy deal at the Swans has been without doubt an unmitigated disaster. Sold the farm to get him and how many flags as a result? = zero. A complete failure. The Dangerfield deal is headed the same way. The Bulldogs Tom Boyd deal on the other hand? Already paid for itself with a premiership so the Doggies the only one of those three clubs to get it right. Flags = success. Nothing else, not number of finals (collingwood supporters), not rising star nominations (Carlton supporters), not brownlow medals, not simply making finals (geelong and sydney supporters).
      The Swans make a habit of it…they messed up big with the Tippett deal too, Barry Hall….

      How anyone can call the Buddy deal a success is beyond me and a joke. It is the greatest failure in AFL history, Dangerfield will be the next.

      • Roar Guru

        November 20th 2017 @ 1:55pm
        Paul D said | November 20th 2017 @ 1:55pm | ! Report

        I would have thought the greatest failure in AFL history was the failure of Essendon to provide adequate oversight of an illegal injection program that resulted in the worst mass suspension in the history of Australian sport and perhaps decades of lawsuits once the substances injected into these players (which Essendon has no idea of) come to light in strange medical abnormalities.

        in contrast, a flag that never existed pales into insignificance

        • November 20th 2017 @ 3:05pm
          Harsh Truth Harry said | November 20th 2017 @ 3:05pm | ! Report

          Lots of assumptions there young Paul fella….it’s done and dusted that whole thing now, the persecution of the greatest club of all is over, lawsuits are all settled and now we simply pick up where we left off and that is, winning flags….while you lot sit on your hands hoping for a final some time in the next decade….

          • Roar Guru

            November 20th 2017 @ 3:38pm
            Paul D said | November 20th 2017 @ 3:38pm | ! Report

            At least we’ve won a final in the last decade

        • November 21st 2017 @ 8:05am
          Rod said | November 21st 2017 @ 8:05am | ! Report


      • November 20th 2017 @ 2:10pm
        Stephen said | November 20th 2017 @ 2:10pm | ! Report

        Harry, good to see ‘you’re in the building’. If your only measure of success is premierships – then yes, Franklin is yet to deliver. But as Brendan Gale said last month on Open Mike – “You can’t win premierships if your club is insolvent”.

        Franklin has made the Swans an old fashion fortune. And it just keeps escalating.

      • Roar Rookie

        November 20th 2017 @ 2:29pm
        Lance Skelton said | November 20th 2017 @ 2:29pm | ! Report

        Here’s the harsh truth Harry, which must be difficult for you to handle; Buddy has been a huge success for Sydney. Measuring everything by premiership success alone is a very limited way to assess the performance of a football club over a period of time. The article explains some of the obvious impacts that Buddy has had on and off the field. Three All Australians, two Coleman medals, one GF, countless finals appearances. Sydney has done remarkably well off the field as well during the Buddy Franklin era. Look at the membership base since he’s arrived, the sponsors, and the merchandise sold. Sounds like you’re one of these toxic trolls out there who just like to be contrary for the sake of it. In fact, based on your comments I think you’d struggle to understand the rules of AFL.

        • November 20th 2017 @ 3:54pm
          Harsh Truth Harry said | November 20th 2017 @ 3:54pm | ! Report

          I coach footy actually young fella and have done for going on 30 years…I watch most games during any AFL season…the thing you lot forget is the competition exists to win flags….otherwise if you are happy with a participation certificate then good luck to you Lance….Alphingtonian is the only sensible one in here, he at keast demands success from Geelong not finals appearances…the Bombers exist to win flags. The dogs Tom Boyd deal is already a success as they got their flag (and Boyd played the best game of his career so far in a grand final)…I just call the harsh truth…there are four clubs only who can win the flag next year Essendon, Richmond, Port Adelaide and Adelaide……fact is the two Adelaide sides don’t get to play the G much so that leaves it down to Ess and Rich….Harrys theory is Richmond got a dream run this year which is unlikley to happen again…hence, Bombers premiers….plus Longmire is a one trick horse. He has Buddy and not much more…Buddy is a champ don’t get me wrong, brilliant player, one of the greatest of all time but until the Swans get a flag with him…..failure as a deal.

          • November 21st 2017 @ 9:31am
            Birdman said | November 21st 2017 @ 9:31am | ! Report

            hilarious assessment of next year’s premiership fancies.

            Randomly select 4 sides then de-select the SA sides because they don’t play the ‘G often then de-select the Tiges because they’ve used up their luck in 2017 leaving…. drum roll…..the Bombers!!.

            Sure, makes sense……

            • November 21st 2017 @ 12:39pm
              Harsh Truth Harry said | November 21st 2017 @ 12:39pm | ! Report

              Go your hardest Birdman then…let’s hear your top 4 , premier and reasons why?

      • November 21st 2017 @ 3:57pm
        Rob said | November 21st 2017 @ 3:57pm | ! Report

        Barry captained them to a flag… by your own conclusions that makes him a very successful recruit…

    • Roar Guru

      November 20th 2017 @ 1:10pm
      Paul D said | November 20th 2017 @ 1:10pm | ! Report

      I’d comfortably say Buddy has been the best free agency signing of any club, in terms of what he has brought to Sydney. He has fitted in well at Sydney, seems to love his footy, got through some severe mental health issues with the help of the club, appears to have found a great partner to back up his life.

      Insisting it’s a failure because Sydney hasn’t won a flag yet is rather like Alphingtonian declaring his club Geelong is a flat failure because they keep finishing top 4 almost every year since 2007 and yet don’t win a flag. I’d love to have some of their problems up at Brisbane.

      • November 20th 2017 @ 1:55pm
        Harsh Truth Harry said | November 20th 2017 @ 1:55pm | ! Report

        That is because Paul D you have a philosophy similar to Carlton, expect the worst (EG: 16th to 18th each season) and then you can always be pleasantly surprised if higher than 16th…as for the Bombers? We throw all our great resources at Flags gentleman, not just making up the numbers like you lot do. Geelong and Sydney now just play to make finals…keeps everyone largely happy it seems by the postings in here….Alphingtonian demands success, demands flags and he is right thats what it is all about gentleman and ladies and the Bombers are headed for number 17 and the status as the greatest VFL-AFL club of all time, standing alone at the very top with 17 flags…hihger then than the sickly Blues, the misguided mess up Magpies, the 37 year drought Tigers and even the Hawks….as for Geelong and the Swans in flag counts you guys aren’t even in the discussion…..

        • Roar Guru

          November 20th 2017 @ 3:11pm
          Paul D said | November 20th 2017 @ 3:11pm | ! Report

          “That is because Paul D you have a philosophy similar to Carlton, expect the worst (EG: 16th to 18th each season) and then you can always be pleasantly surprised if higher than 16th”

          What you call expecting the worst I call being realistic. Yes I could go round belching out how my club won a 3peat back in 2001-03 and clinging to past glories – much as you do with your 14 VFL era flags – but what is the point of that? I don’t count VFL flags, if it was won before 1990 it doesn’t mean spit anymore

          “We throw all our great resources at Flags gentleman, not just making up the numbers like you lot do.”

          Indeed, all the resources of the pharmaceutical department as well. How is not winning a finals match in 14 years not making up the numbers? You never replied to my reply about how you said you’d been at the last 16 grand finals either – by my reckoning the first one you went to then was in 2001 to see Essendon get thumped by us, and you missed seeing Essendon’s 2000 win over the Dees. No wonder you’re a little bitter.

          “Geelong and Sydney now just play to make finals…keeps everyone largely happy it seems by the postings in here”

          I think at some point you have to give some credence to a successful home and away season keeping a club in good health. Your goldfish memory might make easy for you to forget the previous 26 odd weeks and think the competition only explodes into life the last Saturday in September but other fans with more intellectual heft and memory remember all the H&A games, and the results and style of play matter a great deal for the long-term health of the club.

          Can’t be bothered with the last part as it’s just bunk. If Essendon do win a flag while Ash McGrath is at the club though you can expect all sorts of abuse for cheating your way to a flag.

          • November 20th 2017 @ 4:01pm
            Harsh Truth Harry said | November 20th 2017 @ 4:01pm | ! Report

            Paul D….I went to GF’s before 2000 as well, plenty….my point is i haven’t missed a GF from 2000 onwards….I’m a MCC member, have so many contacts at the club I coach have always had access to a ticket champ….

            Paul, the fact you choose to disregard pre 1990 is your choice fella…but Harry hates telling ya the comp has been going a while longer than you have been playing Nintendo son….like it or not…the records exist and the AFL itself acknowledge them…so you and your generation choose what you want but its just smoke and mirrors son…Fact is Fitzroy weren’t much chop and apart from a few years your mob aren’t much either…. as for the home and away season…I love it it is great, but it is the win loss ladder position and flags that comes from it that is more important than you lot all having a friendly pat on your backs while handing out participation certificates…

            • Roar Guru

              November 20th 2017 @ 4:24pm
              Paul D said | November 20th 2017 @ 4:24pm | ! Report

              Ooooh, I’m getting champed on an online forum. Goosebumps.

              So you didn’t get to the 2000 grand final? That must sting. Did you get to 1993 at least?

              What was your thoughts on the 2001 grand final? I usually only hear Collingwood fans complaining about our era so it would be refreshing to hear the words of an Essendon member. Especially one who was actually there.

              I’d have no problem with Essendon bragging about 16 flags if Port Adelaide were allowed to brag about having 37 flags. Surely all state comps should be treated the same.

              I don’t care a jot about Fitzroy. I just like watching and playing football.

              Where do you coach? It’s interesting that someone who’s a coach of juniors and at development level at a country football club has your sort of attitude towards success and winning. I’ve never encountered that sort of attitude from anyone who has access to junior participants, it’s generally seen as an anachronism and a leading contributor to encouraging poor behaviour stemming from a win-at-all-costs attitude.

              • November 20th 2017 @ 5:10pm
                Hungry Jack said | November 20th 2017 @ 5:10pm | ! Report

                I agree, Paul. It’s junior coaches with this attitude that turn parents and their kids off and they leave to play soccer. Any reputable junior club would not have a bar of this dude. He won’t tell you where he coaches . . . fictional? I hope so!

              • November 21st 2017 @ 9:30am
                Harsh Truth Harry said | November 21st 2017 @ 9:30am | ! Report

                out of respect for my boys I’m not listing where I coach but let me tell you this….under 17’s is very competitive…why? I am teaching the boys to get ready for senior footy where they come up against 100 kilo 6 foot 5’s….I need them to be hardened and ready for senior footy for their own sakes and for the sake of the club….when I coached Under 12’s? of course it was different…it’s about giving all the kids a go, trying different positions and non competitive.

              • November 21st 2017 @ 9:48am
                Harsh Truth Harry said | November 21st 2017 @ 9:48am | ! Report

                I was there in 2000. 1999 I missed.

              • November 21st 2017 @ 10:30am
                Macca said | November 21st 2017 @ 10:30am | ! Report

                Harold – I was there in 1999, sat in front of some Essendon supporters who spent about half an hour before the game discussing how & where they were going to buy the Grand Final tickets!!!

                It is one of the best days I have had at the footy.

                On you U17 coaching – surely you can see that getting the kids ready to play senior football can be achieved without winning – yes you want to win and you want the kids to be competitive but there are measures of progress beyond winning!

              • Roar Guru

                November 21st 2017 @ 11:42am
                Paul D said | November 21st 2017 @ 11:42am | ! Report

                So after asking you about this 3 or 4 times you’ve now decided to run with actually being there in 2000, but not there in 1999? That means you made the last 17 grand finals, not 16.

                you have the same paralysing fear of revealing anything that might bust your concocted story anon has.

              • November 21st 2017 @ 12:42pm
                Harsh Truth Harry said | November 21st 2017 @ 12:42pm | ! Report

                Macca…of course there are! My win at all costs methodology is in regard to the AFL not under 17 footy. Yes we play to win but we play to learn and play to prepare these young men for a brutal senior competition. It is not all about winning the flag each year in under 17’s but it is about the young fellas getting the best out of their abilities…

              • November 21st 2017 @ 2:48pm
                Macca said | November 21st 2017 @ 2:48pm | ! Report

                PaulD – The bombers lost the prelim in 1999 to the blues.

                HTH – so at under 17 suburban footy it is about educating but if you have a team in which more than half the starting 22 is under 21 at AFL level it should only be about winning not “about the young fellas getting the best out of their abilities”?

                Players don’t go into AFL finished products.

              • November 21st 2017 @ 3:38pm
                Stephen said | November 21st 2017 @ 3:38pm | ! Report

                Macca, I was called out by Cat yesterday. While I’ve been banging on about Carlton’s $8.5m membership revenue as an issue. It was highlighted to me – the club in which I hold membership (EFC) is only 20% higher in 2017 at $11m.

                So I guess I should man-up and confess to my hypocrisy. And so I shall.

              • November 21st 2017 @ 3:45pm
                Macca said | November 21st 2017 @ 3:45pm | ! Report

                No worries Stephen but it does highlight a couple of things – larger numbers doesn’t result in higher membership revenue, depending on what type of membership it is.

                Also people are talking up the blues “crisis” when they are simply in the middle of the pack for memberships rather than in the top 4.

                Finally in 2016 the blues were 14th for distributions received from the AFL – if there was a crisis that wold not be the case.

                All that said obviously the blues are striving to increase their membership.

              • November 21st 2017 @ 4:57pm
                Stephen said | November 21st 2017 @ 4:57pm | ! Report

                Right. Its also interesting to note both Carlton and Essendon only generate ~$165 per membership on average – compared with WCE and possibly Collingwood at $300+ for each member registered.

                That’s the first question I would be asking if I had any input into the matter at CFC/EFC. I’m missing something obvious I suspect. Those numbers don’t pass the ‘sniff test’.

        • November 20th 2017 @ 3:22pm
          Stephen said | November 20th 2017 @ 3:22pm | ! Report

          Fair point Harry. Read an interesting article recently on the NFL in the United States. The gist was – club owners were finding it increasingly expensive and therefore a poor investment – to increase salaries and recruit top-end players. In fact in some cases – one or two owners admitted anonymously to being satisfied with ‘mid-table’ results and lower expenses. This guaranteed the owners their cable TV revenues and minimized their running costs.

          Not a scenario we would like to see in this country.

          • November 20th 2017 @ 3:25pm
            Harsh Truth Harry said | November 20th 2017 @ 3:25pm | ! Report

            but perhaps the scenario behind the failing top up philosophies of Geelong and Sydney? Both have a game plan built around their weird little toy grounds, both get found out in finals on the big wide G ….

          • Roar Guru

            November 20th 2017 @ 3:42pm
            Cat said | November 20th 2017 @ 3:42pm | ! Report

            Not one you will see either. No private owners. No private TV networks. No privately owned stadiums. A salary cap floor (American sports have no salary floor). No ability to trade expiring contracts. No ability to be ‘buyers’ or ‘sellers’ at an in-season trade deadline.

            The total amount of the length of AFLs ‘big contracts’ don’t even measure up to half of a single year of NFL ‘big contracts’.

            Buddy 9yr @ $10m AUD – $1.1m per annum (AUD)
            Andrew Luck 6yr @ $140m USD – $23.3m per annum (USD)

            NFL salary cap: $12.45m AUD
            AFL Salary cap: $167m USD

            Franklin takes up ~ 8.83% of the Swans cap
            Luck takes up ~13.95% of his teams cap

            NFL has already pushed how much one player can get in comparison to the AFL. (NFL rosters are 53 man compared to AFL 40 man lists too)

            • November 20th 2017 @ 3:53pm
              Stephen said | November 20th 2017 @ 3:53pm | ! Report

              You’re all over it Cat! Good information. Thanks for sharing.

            • November 20th 2017 @ 4:05pm
              Harsh Truth Harry said | November 20th 2017 @ 4:05pm | ! Report

              Checked the population of the USA against Australia lately? Of course its different!

              • Roar Guru

                November 20th 2017 @ 4:41pm
                Cat said | November 20th 2017 @ 4:41pm | ! Report

                Don’t need to check.

      • November 20th 2017 @ 2:15pm
        Stephen said | November 20th 2017 @ 2:15pm | ! Report

        Thanks Paul D. I hadn’t looked at it in that light – Franklin being the best free agency recruit. Now you mention it – no one has come close for mine. Perhaps Goddard’s leadership at Essendon through a horrid spell.

        • November 20th 2017 @ 2:17pm
          Harsh Truth Harry said | November 20th 2017 @ 2:17pm | ! Report

          Goddard leads the best free agency signings of all time, next…..Chris Mayne….an absolute gem of a signing by Gubby Allan.

          • November 20th 2017 @ 3:01pm
            Hungry Jack said | November 20th 2017 @ 3:01pm | ! Report

            Closet Pies supporter! According to the laws of Harsh Truth Goddard is a slow, cranky old man. Way past his prime. Cannot play midfield anymore and will be run ragged in defence by the influx of fast, pressure forwards. Certainly got found out by the Swannies pace in the finals this year! Not a shadow of Buddy!

            • November 20th 2017 @ 3:08pm
              Harsh Truth Harry said | November 20th 2017 @ 3:08pm | ! Report

              Can’t you understand humour Hungry Jack? Do you really think I meant the Mayne deal was a good one….blimey, your generation are a worry …..too much time on your Nintendo!

              • November 20th 2017 @ 4:01pm
                Hungry Jack said | November 20th 2017 @ 4:01pm | ! Report

                Yeah I understand humor but it seems no one is laughing with you, merely at you. Glad you’re keeping yourself amused.

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